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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Bleedin' Brakes! - End of my tether


I am absolutely at the end of my tether trying to sort my brakes out!! Car's been off the road two years, one of the last jobs should be to bleed brakes...

The story so far (it's a single-circuit system BTW)

Connect up the Eezibleed.One of the front hoses is blocked, so replaced with braided hoses.

Get oil through to all the wheel cylinders, seems fine except no feel in the pedal whatsoever. Go around it a couple of times with the eezibleed, still the pedal goes to the floor.

Notice some bubbles in the master cylinder, so assume the seals have had it and replace them. try again and get the same result. Nothing.

The rear cylinders both look a little suspect, so replace them both, no change.

Get a totally new master cylinder. Same again. Air getting sucked back into the MC when the pedal is allowed to come back up. There's a bit of pedal resistance if it's pumped up vigourously, and there's a cloud of bubbles in the MC.

Check all the joints back through the system - no detectable leaks.

I don't know what to do next - any suggestions? It's so frustrating, cos I'm so nearly finished, and it should be so simple! Please help before I loose it and trash the car.

Thanks
Mark
MarkH

eezibleed

first ensure ALL pipe end fittings are tight, air can enter without necessarily leaking fluid out

then recheck the same!

Bleed the furthest cylinder from the master first (with a full reservoir and external bottle)

then next furthest away (so you have done both ends of the rear axle)

then the next furthest (N/S F on a UK car) then the O/S F and tighten the nipple on the caliper

if you have a plastic reservoir I have heard of them allowing air in at the base, but that is hearsay only I dont have one.

I knew a garage hand once that insisted there was no need to work in such a sequence, but he couldnt eliminate the air in the system

I did

I hope this helps you

by the way dont forget the front to rear pipe travels inside the proptunnel, it hasnt worked loose and against the prop and begun leaking down in the darkest hole has it?

Anything that can go wrong....
Bill

In this situation I would first of all ditch the easibleed and begin a logical approach.
First thing to do is find out if the master cylinder is working correctly. This is done by disconnecting the pipe that comes directly from the master cylinder into its first connection point. Generally at the multiway joint inside the engine compartment. Test here to see if pressure builds up when the master cylinder is pressed. Also using a tube and bottle it can be bled here in the traditional method.
I sometimes make up some simple blanks to blank off other parts of the braking circuit to be able to fault find in a logical manner when things are less than straight forward bringing in one wheel at a time.
Bob (Robert) Midget Turbo

Sounds like you need to bench bleed the master.

From the ouput side of the master use a hose looped up and into and BELOW the fluid level in the master then stroke the master full travel SLOWLY.

NLA

Have you got your brake calipers on the right way? Bleed nipple at the top.
Neil
K series

Mark,
Having been through this process recently myself and had several abortive attempts with the eezibleed, I found the most foolproof method was to let the eesibleed do the work and refrain from pumping the pedal.
One of the mistakes I made was that I had unwittingly exhausted all the air from the donor tyre and once the pressure had dropped, air was sucked back into the system.
I believe that there are two important points to be aware of;-
1) That the adapter cap to the reservoir is absoluteley airtight (it will save a hell of a mess if this is tested before filling with fluid)

2)That the tyre has no more than 20lbs.psi (if there are no airleaks there should be enough pressure to complete the job) and that there is sufficient fluid in the bottle and the reservoir to complete the job without the need to refill.

In the event, I successfully bled the brakes without displacing much of the old fluid. It may be a different matter if you are purging all the old fluid from the system (as recommended as a complete fluid change)

Dave
Penwithian


Neil - I think you've hit the nail on the head.

Can't believe it - that's probably the only thing I didn't consider. Swapped calipers might explain my other question about the Goodridge hoses being on the short side, too, and why I was struggling to fit the pad between the piston and disc. It's all ar*e about face!! I reassembled the suspension with the shell upside down, and I'm guessing I got confused over left and right 'cos it was the wrong way up.

Unbelieveable.

Well, at lest it's a pretty easy swap, and hopefully should solve my problem just like that. I'm at a wedding using wedding cars sevenoaks next weekend so will have to wait until the weekend after, but will report back on progress.

Neil - I owe you one. Any time you're in Cornwall, come and claim your pint!

I love this board. You're all stars.

Thank you
Mark
MarkH1

Mark,
Do I qualify for a pint?
I shall be down in the Cornish homeland next April.
A pint of 'Tinners' or 'Tribute' would go down a treat! LOL
Dave
Penwithian


I've checked and my memory had let me down, actually the calipers ARE the right way up with the bleed screws at the top.

NLA - I bled the master before it went in, and it seemed OK. But everything is under suspicion at the moment. I think I'll have to try Bob's approach and isolate the lines one by one.


Dave - My current favourite is Skinners' Knocker. I'm also partial to HSD. You'd be very welcome to join me for a couple of them any time! Which part of the soon-to-be-history Penwith?
MarkH1

Mark,
"Soon to be history Penwith"
You have me worried now, are they changing the names of the local districts as they did in Wales some years ago?
Myself and the rest of my Essex brood make an annual pilgimage to Cornwall to see my diminishing circle of relations and friends. This time we are staying near Praa Sands, about half way between Helston and Penzance.

Originally I came from St Michaels Mount.

Dave
Penwithian

Maybe Kernow is about to secede from the union

wouldnt blarry blame em

might move down there then if I could get my passport stamped and an entry visa
Bill

No passport or visa required Bill.

You don't even have to pay to get in. You have to pay to get out though. (if you are using the Tamar bridge, that is)

Dave
Penwithian

I'd rather pay and use that lovely ferry at Torpoint

I was on that once when the steering rope from the wheel to the rudder fell off its pulley

me and the ferryman had a happy five minutes putting it all together again, midstream....

drifting

happy days
Bill

Bill,
I trust the ferryman had his AA membership card about his person.

Wasn't the ferry chain driven? I forget , many years since I used it.

Dave
Penwithian

I don't think it was chain driven at at Torpoint, it wouldn't have needed a rudder if it was on a chain

and guess what?

As so often I forgot to ask if he'd his card with him...

I think the vehicle ferry further along is chainb powered though

like the one on Lake Windermere...

oh no

it seems the Windermere one is on a cable.

Guy?


Bill

The King Harry ferry is chain driven.

Took a trip on it last weekend while taking a short cut between St Mawes and Truro.
Dave O'Neill 2


As of next month, Cornwall will be a unitary authority and the districts will cease to exist. Who knows what that means? My wife doesn't and she works for the council...

My son loves the King Harry ferry - you can go across for 20p on foot. Doing the trip to the ice cream shop on the other side and back is his idea of a great afternoon out!

MarkH

Whilst on a Cornish (Kernowish???) theme my RWA had a body off restoration done about 15 years ago in Gillan Garage, Manaccan (not far from the Lizard my Google suggests) - is my midget the most southerly restored one in the UK???
robint

Must be something they put in at Warrens pasties to make us Cornish buy these little cars. Heavens knows it's not the meat content.
Cousin Jack.
B Richards

This thread was discussed between 28/09/2008 and 10/10/2008

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