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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Frogeye rack inner balljoint

The inner ball joint on my Frogeye rack (rack side as shown) has very slight play (felt by hand on the bench). Other side feels ok. I've read the archive and understand you can adjust shims but it sounds very diffcult to separate the joint. So do I leave it and see what it's like on the car or tear into it, possbly causing damage?


Bill Bretherton

I think the rack is similar to the Mini. I had the same problem on my Mini many decades ago and a C spanner is needed to get the balljoint apart. That could not be done with the rack in the car, so my dad made a tubular spanner that got it undone. Sorry but I have lost the spanner!

Les
L B Rose

It's the luck of the draw Bill, some come apart easy, some don't--
Release the thin metal locking sleeve out of the grooves with a screwdriver or similar
Wind the rack out as far as it'll go and grab the flat toothed part in the vice using soft jaws to protect it and unscrew the tie rod assembly off the rack, you'll need a C spanner or if you're carefull you can use an adjustable pipe wrench by hooking an outside jaw tooth in one of the grooves and a piece of soft metal between the inner jaw and the cap-
Now that it's off , remove the lock washer/sleeve and using a vice with nice sharp jaws grab the edge of the end piece and using your C spanner or whatever and also holding the tierod back for support, unscrew the cap
Sometimes(most times) these are very tight and you might have to file/cut some flats on the edge of the end piece to get a good grip
There is a tool with a couple of pins that go into holes on that end piece but usually the pins aren't up to the job
Don't fall into the trap of grabbing the cap in the vice and trying to undo the end piece, doing this tightens the cap even tighter
Now it's apart you can adjust shims to get a nice firm even feel and put it back together, you can tighten it all up together as one on the rack, make sure the lock tags locate into the grooves on the end of the rack,and when it's all tight knock the lock tag sleeve down into the grooves
William Revit

I tackled one of these years ago and don't recall any problems. It was a 1500 rack which might explain it, or maybe I was just lucky.

But one thing, Bill. Are you sure the slight movement you feel isn't the rack itself moving laterally against the rack damper? It's a lot easier to remove a shim from there!
GuyW

Mine's had a tiny bit of play on the N/S for 30 years and its never been a problem.Depending on how bad yours is, I would be wary taking the joint apart unless you have the right tools.
Bob Beaumont

Thanks again everyone.
Les, I'll search the depths of my toolbox for a C spanner.
Willy, that's a very thorough description, I think I get it but am concerned about causing damage.
Guy, I'll check again for where the play is.
Bob, the inner tie rods feel quite loose in the ball joints although I can't detect play in the n/s joint. I am quite wary about disturbing parts that may not need it.

Generally, is any play acceptable in the inner ball joints (I have new TRE's)?
Bill Bretherton

Logically, I would think that unless it is rattling-loose, any slight wear there is gong to be very small when compared to what is considered acceptable tolerance at, for example, the wheel rim when checking front wheel bearings.
GuyW

AS Guy says if they are rattling then replace them. They are quite loose anyway. I have a spare rack and the tie rods are quite sloppy although I can't detect any wear. The steering assembly on a Sprite seems to be quite robust with low wear anyway
Bob Beaumont

The ball joint in question has slight visible movement, so I decided to see if would undo, which it has using a mole wrench and emery paper. This afternoon I'll see if will separate and report back.
Bill Bretherton

Guy, Bob
I ended up leaving it, as you recommended. Should have listened! Despite Willy's excellent instructions there was no way the ball joint would separate with my resources. Well at least I know! So I'll fit the rack as is.
Bill Bretherton

I have never had any luck removing the ball caps without damaging the shims. I replaced the rack on my 1971 (should be the same as the Frog) with one of the Argentine racks from Moss and it has been great. I use one on the B as well and it has not loosened up a bit, even after 80,000 miles or so. These racks are inexpensive and represent a huge improvement. The slightest bit of play in the system translates into lots of slop in the steering wheel.
Glenn Mallory

This thread was discussed between 07/04/2020 and 12/04/2020

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