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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Front suspension advice

Hi there, i'm just wondering if anyone out there has any advice on how to stop my Midge jumping all over the road on uneven surfaces, (as all of north yorkshires roads are like this!) I've been told that fitting competition valves to the shock absorbers and using 10/30 engine oil is a good remedy, i'm only young and new to the midget modifying game and may be totally wrong in this assumption but shurely this would only stiffen up the shockers?? The front suspension is in good order with new rubber bushes throughout and no play in the components, i really don't want to fork out £400 for a frontline conversion!! Can anybody help...please!
J Rose

Remember, a Spridget, even one that's in perfect condition, jumps about on the collection of potholes that now pass for roads in England!

I'd check the dampers are damping and have oil in them, use the correct damper oil, thicker oils will stiffen the dampers, but only till the damper valves are destroyed!

Stiffer comp valves really need to be part of a wider modifacation plan to be effective and that's not likely to be cheap.

Try a drop of grease, it might have been a while since it was last done.

And don't be afraid to ask!

AndyB
a borris

as you said ther is no play an you have new rubber bushes (take poly bushes the next time)

how is the tracking?
are you top trunions on the right way around?
do you have a anti rollbar?

check the dampers as stated above (check if they leak)

and start saving up for that frontline kit
it is the best mod you can do to the front suspention of a midget
and wil cure the mentioned problems
Onno Könemann

These cars were designed over 50 years ago and the somewhat stiff, vertical movement of the suspension comes as standard. They will never ride like a modern car whatever you do, but you are right in thinking that stiffening up the dampers will make things worse. You don't want to do that. My suggestion would be to check that the springs and dampers are indeed to standard spec, and that the ride height is correct - because over the years it may have been modified - and change them back if they're not. But learn to slow down a bit when you see a broken surface - because we all do that.
f pollock

At what speeds are you experiencing these problems?
Daniel Thirteen-Twelve

Thanks for all your advice so far. I had a midget that i restored several years ago and never remember it being that bad on bumpy roads even as an unexperienced 18 year old! I know the midge will never ride like a moden car but it just feels so unpredictable, it seems mainly at 30+ mph the problems start to occur. There is a 9/16" roll bar with new drop links fitted. The only thing i haven't checked is the shocker oil level, does anyone recommend a suitable oil, i know moss do several grades?
J Rose

20w motor cycle fork oil, if you have access to a sringe with a huge needle that works really well...check with a professional wall paper store, they have them for injecting glue under the surface of loose wall paper....just be careful, DO NOT put in pockets and keep it in front of you at all times inorder to keep track of it, you dont want an injection of hydro oil, and in this position its easy to do.

Prop
Prop

I would suggest checking your toe-in. If the wheels are pointing out a bit the car will wander when you hit a hole. Usually if you hit the hole with your right wheel the car will go left and vice versa. Been there, adjusted the toe-in, problem went away.
Martin Washington

"I would suggest checking your toe-in. If the wheels are pointing out a bit the car will wander when you hit a hole."

Actually it can be worse than that. I've had a bolt on the steering arm break because I had too much toe out when I hit a rather large pothole.

Be sure to check for wear in the suspension. Worn bushings will contribute to bad handling at least as much as bad shocks.
S.A. Jones

Jim.

I'm in Yorkshire (Home Knaresborough and Work Stockton on the Forest) and would be more than happy to look with you at your car and problem.

As advised above, the shocks are probably the key, but they really NEED to be topped up and bled on the bench, not on the car. Tracking is also critical, so perhaps needs a set up.

Give me a call or drop by and we'll see if we can't get you a smoother ride....

Oh, Don't forget the Mini bits we discussed....

Mark.

07889 799033

MG Car Club Tech adviser.
Midget and Sprite Club Tech adviser.
M T Boldry

Did anyone mention tyre pressue? Over inflated tyres will cause harsh ride and will bounce the car about. Drop the pressure to about 24 psi on all four corners and test to see if it gets better. It takes some experimenting to get the pressures to a proper place given you size/type of tyre.
Trevor Jessie

Oops, Trevor beat me to it.

Tire pressure can make a very obvious difference - too firm, and you'll tapdance all over the road in bumpy corners.

The factory spec tire pressures were 22 front and 24 rear, IIRC. I run mine at 26 front and 28 rear, and this seems to give nice crisp handling without the skitters.

As for stiffening up dampers, heavier oil is not the way to go. Uprated valves, plus the specified damper fluid, are the correct approach.

Are you sure your front dampers are in good shape, with no fore/aft slop in the lever arms? That kind of wear in the lever arm bushes can cause looseness and self-steer on the road, as well as encouraging more wear on the lower trunnion. Been there - rebuilt front dampers made a world of difference.

-:G:-
Gryf Ketcherside

Trevor and Gryf beat me to tire pressures too. Don't run the tires, or tyres as you say over the pond, too hard or the car will jump all over the place!
Clive Reddin

Isnt that the purpose of a frog to jump? ;)









Ill get my coat...
Arie de Best

Thanks again for all your advice, the shocks seemed to be the logical place to start so i've just removed the Right hand front one, it didn't seem to damp on either stroke, and guess what.....a drip of oil was all that was in there!! I've topped it up with a motor cycle fork oil and bled it on the bench as Mark recommended and now it feels like a damper should.

The only problem i've noticed other than the lack of oil is there is some detectable play in the shock arm which i could not feel on the car but it is noticeable on the bench,does anyone know how much play is acceptable with these units?

Thanks James
J Rose

James, if the play is in the arm to the shaft, there should be NONE.That is a tapered spline on the shaft, and any wear there at all is bad.
If there is play felt only when reversing motion up and down on the arm, that is likely a wrist pin or two that have gotten loose. It will likely get worse over time, but it is not as dangerous as the other. That play affects performance, the other is safety.

Peter C
Peter Caldwell

James,
You need to listen to Peter. He is apparently one of the best rebuilders of lever arms in the US, and knows what he's talking about.
Steve Clark

Took the Midge out for a spin last night after stripping the front suspension and filling up the shocks, (10w motorcycle fork oil), what a difference! I could tell the improvement instantly, I could drive down a fairly bumpy road at 50 mph and the car tracked straight! Just amazing to think that 1 empty shock, (drivers side), could cause all this!!
The play on the front shock arms are a worry though, it seems as if there is play between the shaft and the body casting, (about 1/16" where the shaft enters the body), I'm going to order some rebuilt shocks but I've herad a lot of people refer to them as "repainted rather than rebuilt!!" Can anyone recommend a trusted supplier of rebuilt units?

Thanks James
J Rose

Mr Caldwell of the post two above your last one has a great reputation in the US of A

Not sure about the costs for shipping though

Try an email to find out?
Bill sdgpm

Peter May is a most reliable and reputable source.

http://www.petermayengineering.co.uk/

Mark.
M T Boldry

consider Frontline
Alex Sturgeon

This thread was discussed between 09/05/2009 and 17/05/2009

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