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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Oil cooler - routing hoses (1500)
This is a continuation of another thread on 1500 oil pressure, thought I'd split it up to keep things organised.
Basically, we are discussing where to route the oil cooler pipes. The kit comes with 2 grommets to route the pipes through the bodywork. But,
1. I don't want to drill through anything structural.
2. Bob suggested the radiator shroud, which is good... although you'd have to disconnect the pipes to whip out the radiator
3. Someone suggested there are already routing holes cos the cooler came as a factory option? If so, where are they?
I've attached a photo (you can see where i've attached my mounts for the cooler... bent 90 degree bracket in the left of the photo.
You will also see a horrible rusty bit of bodywork (its even worse underneath)... Is this structural btw, cos its Sh****d
Anyone got any photos of where their pipes route?
|C L Carter|
|Through the shroud isn't really a problem. If you do need to take the rad & shroud out you can just disconnect the hoses at the engine end and lift the lot out in one.|
The other way is to cut a slot in the shroud to the front then you can just slip the hoses out if need be. Personally I think plan A is the better option.
Hopefully you won't need to remove the rad too often though.
|Here's a photo of the original holes for the oil cooler hoses, in a 1275 front valence. The 1500 will be a lot different, but look for holes about this size near the top of the ducting, under the slam panel.
|the photo Bill has put up, isn't that the splash sheild(?)|
that's where I'm expecting the hoses to route through
they stay in situ when the rad and rad shroud are removed
if you can get at them to drill through they're not structual
always thought it was a bit of a funny idea to put the oil cooler in front of ther rad on old cars
|Here's a pic of my oil cooler install, on the shelf just in front of and below the radiator, with the radiator removed for clarity. I chose to utilize the large hole that normally feeds the heater intake, as I did not use braided lines and wanted to avoid chafing of the rubber lines in tight spaces. It seemed the most natural location for the oil lines, avoiding tight bends in the oil lines i.e. reduced flow. I used cheap water pipe insulation where the hoses go through the hole just to be sure no chafing would occur over time. If you install the oil cooler thermostat as in the pic you will forgo the need for shrouding the cooler in the winter. I was lucky to find some nice 45 degree fittings to fit the cooler which kept the hoses in a more natural, less bent configuration.|
Hey! Note the GM alternator conversion, per the Teglerizer website which provides both access to the #1 plug as well as extra room for the cooler lines: half the price, twice the amps, four times the availability and eight times the reliability, with the original Lucas plug retained, just in case some DFO wants to revert to original equipment.
This may be the first time DFO has ever been used in a thread. Ha!
|Right, Richard. Your set up looks great, but I'd like to keep the elephants trunk if possible. |
From you're photo you can see a singular hole where the heater intake hole is - this, I think, is an access hole for a socket to remove the radiator fixings. There are no other holes in it as far as I can tell - but if its not structural I guess there can be.
Bob, the shroud still sounds best to me. But I'm lazy and don't want to have to drain the rad again - I wonder if I could do it in situ.
|C L Carter|
|Nigel - We may be getting into semantics here, the Moss catalog refers to that part as the "Front End Assembly", and the separate but similar parts as "Splash Plates". |
Here's a pic of the back side of the Front End Assembly as installed, but without the Splash Plates.
|....and a picture of the "Splash Plate". |
I don't know if the 1500 uses these, but, if so, similar holes need to be added here as well.
|The two holes on my 1500 body, I believe ive drilled the top hole myself but the other was there originaly.|
So are the (4)bolt-holes for the oilfilterbracket in the lower shroud.(no photo available)
|Arie de Best|
|Arie, thats very nice - although the one that is there already is how I access the radiator mounting bolt. Although I think there is probably room for 2 additional holes. Now that I know someone else is drilling through those panels I am more comfortable in doing so too.|
|C L Carter|
|I'm pretty sure there were already holes there that I used on my 1500, as shown in the picture.
|And this one shows the hoses lying alongside the elephants trunk.
|I will have another look.|
But at least I know I can drill into that now. Are any of those think sheet metal bits at the front structural? Or do they sort of just hold the wings apart, IYKWIM?
|C L Carter|
I can't even spell sermanticks let alone know what it means :) the question mark (in brackets) was quereing my description/name for that panel not yours and whether it was what I thought it was
I was wrong, looking at Terry Horler's book the oil cooler wasn't an optional extra for the 1500
I don't know about the splash/mud panels/plates/sheilds being structual so wont say
|I was glad to see JB and FRM posts confirming that for normal road use and not regular long high speed motorway blast or sports use that with a midget 1500 engine and cooling system in good condition that you dont need an oil cooler|
on another forum a chap told of his mothers 70 mile roundtrip work commute for 20 years in a 1500 Midget with no problems
firstly as I put on the other thread, I was wrong about the oil cooler being an option for the 1500
and with respect, your old engine might need the oil cooler but oil is the secondary cooling system, fully check your primary 'water' cooling systems components and parts are in good condition and fully functioning
I seemed to remember (somewhere) you put something about possible airlock, as Ive had to do far too many coolant drain downs and refills on my previous classic and my present (1275) it is one area where I'm almost reasonable at it, Ive had to do nothing more than (wait for it) follow the instructions in the Drivers Handbook with no further problems
I have a quite thorough system as Ive had cars that hold a lot of engine heat for a long time and after use so I like to prevent heat problems and have a good margin of operation so that if something overheats I have an opportunity to get the car home to work on rather than at the side of the road I used to have to do roadside checks or get-me-home-repairs but Im older and wiser (in this respect) now
if you want my version of what to do on the coolant side I can bore others with it again or email it to you for you to ignore
|yes nigel that would be good, I think you have my email.|
I have noticed that the new thermostat I installed doesn't have a bleed hole float thing like the old one did - perhaps that is making it harder to fill the system.
|C L Carter|
|I keep very few email address on my computer so that viruses aren't spread from it|
and you know the state of my mental memory
email me at nigel atkins(all one word) at bt internet (all one word) dot com and I'll reply from it
I wouldn't think the thermostat would cause air problems - did you check thermostat for opening and closing temperatures before fitting
someone told me they never add coolant via the elbow plug but if you followed the instructions in the driver's Handbook I'd imagine that would work
personally I like to add coolant premixed rather than coolant to water in system and slowly with funnel with pipe but when added at roadside I'd leave pressure cap off for a good while with engine up to temp and running to check for air bubles rising
|So I came to fit the oil cooler today and after 3 hours of fiddling... I removed everything and will try again later. The 2 problems I had are thus:|
1. The nearest pipe kinks. I think this is because I was trying to route the hoses through the big air hole which is too low. Once my new cone bit arrives I will drill 2 large enough holes as high as I can to route the hoses.
2. The oil filter adaptor plate is made from a cheese type alloy, and the steel adaptor bolt that goes through it (see photo) has a hex on the end which accross flats is the same size as its shank - so the points of the hex are the only part in contact with the plate, so it bites into the alloy and cuts off fine shreds WHICH GO INTO THE OIL. Naturally I removed it and gave up at this point. I'm thinking of making a thin washer to fit behind the bolt. But did anyone else have this problem on their 1500? Is it just a poor quality kit?
Any help or ideas much appreciated.
|C L Carter|
|GregH from Aus had a thread up about oil cooler pipes routing and I think it was that thread that included advice and previous problems with the modern kits|
|I have the nearest hose from the cooler to the drilled hole with a 45C angle metal hose fitting.|
This would make the hose go in a flowing bend instead of knacking.
Not photo of the 45c ones but you get the picture.
|Arie de Best|
|Another shot of my other 1500 with no oil cooler fitted shows the hole above the trunking aperture to be a rout for the wiring loom.
|My first post never appeared, so here it is again;-|
The oil cooler pipes on my 1500 pass through the bottom of the elephant trunk aperture without any need for surgery or drilling, there's still plenty of room for the trunking.
This thread was discussed between 24/06/2012 and 02/07/2012
This thread is from the archive. The Live MG Midget and Sprite Technical BBS is active now.