MG Midget and Sprite Technical Speedo drive for a type 9 BBS discussion at MG-Cars.net

MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Speedo drive for a type 9

Apart from the Triumph engined conversions for A-Series engines I have always used Morris Minor Centre (Birmingham) Ltd now part of the David Manners group. A few months ago I went to France to help with another T9 conversion having previously dry built the parts required to fit a T9 to a 948 engine here in U.K. for the owner to take out. I made a bespoke clutch release for it previously. I am awaiting a bracket from U.S.A. that avoids the need to cut the chassis. I may retro fit it to a car.

Alan Anstead

I have made a couple of bell-housings and a few modified chassis strengtheners & braces over the years but usually fit the MMC kits purchased by whomsoever I am doing the conversion for. Originally they advertised their kits for all engine sizes until I explained the difference between smooth-case and rib-case and they dropped the 948 from their advert. I have always found them helpful. The pictures of the bracket are too large to load. It does look tight on the crossmember that may need some tweeking.

Alan Anstead

I found an angle drive on ebay which didn't cost much. I was able to modify the input so it fitted directly into the Ford box and the output was the same as the old gearbox so I used the original cable. This is so much better than looping the cable under the carpet. Cutting the selector casting is easy but welding it isn't so. The aluminium is very poor quality and after years of being exposed to oil it is difficult to get a clean weld. Perhaps an ultra sonic clean would help. Jan T

J Targosz

You got a great deal there Jan. I originally ran my speedo cable (Ford one end, Smiths Spridget speedo cable the other end) across the floor too. But then I bought, (at Alan Anstead's recommendation I think, or may have been someone else) a type 9 adapted right angle drive from -- https://www.speedograph-richfield.com/shop/angle-drives/rgb1030 The ad' says a new speedo cable is needed. I assume they must have altered it since I bought it, because what I bought fits the type 9 box, and takes the original Spridget speedo cable without modification. The speedo cable now follows the original factory route to the speedo. It works a treat. I don't remember paying 95 quid for it though. It's gone up a tad I think. Lol. On that bolt on bracket from America. It looks great, but I too don't see how you avoid cutting the cross member, because the t9 gearbox mount is what interferes with it. See picture. But, if that new bolted on mounting bracket sits on the original Spridget cross member, then I guess you can just cut the original Ford T9 mount off completely, allowing the box to slide into position easily. In which case, I wish that bracket had been around when I did mine. It could though, still prove its weight in gold, if dvla found out, and came at us for altered chassis, re the historic classification/mot exempt stuff. Just reinstate the cross member, cut the Ford protrusionoff, and use the new bolt on bracket.

anamnesis

Anamnesis Still waiting upon its arrival but this is what is instructed. Alan

Alan Anstead

Alan it seems so obvious now. I wish I'd thought if it. I'm amazed nobody ever had the idea and made this bracket before. How long have they been making it in the US? Guy yes, I assume the flat plate I've arrowed crudely, sits on top of the original cross member. To be able to, Alan shows where the rib also needs cutting back, as otherwise it will hit the crossmember, and prevent the box sliding back far enough to let the bracket rest on the crossmember. There's a picture of my install somewhere in the archives, that shows this rib sitting just inside the cut section of my cross member. I'm really amazed this idea hasn't surfaced before now.

anamnesis

Anamnesis. One of the recipients is ahead of the pack and has notched his x-member, as shown in the picture, presumably to retain the rib on the gearbox. The inventor apparently just tapped the leading edge to clear on his own fitment. I am quite happy just making clutch release bearings for 1275’s when using a stock clutch for enthusiasts and garages. I some times make a bespoke 1098 one for projects that people involve me in. I spent a few days in France, earlier this year, assisting with a T9 / 948 conversion that I had previously set up on my workbench at home.

Alan Anstead

I just had a gander at my Sprite T9 installation again. I've got 9/16inch between my crank damper/pulley and the crossmember the rack sits on. So I guess I could still slide forward a bit, to lessen either the dent in the tunel crossmember, or the metal that needed to be cut from the rib on the box extension. Here's a picture under mine, showing the rib in relation to the cut in the crossmember. I'm pretty sure it's not the heater tray that's in the way, to avoid the extension rib interfering with the crossmember Guy. It's the height of the tunnel above and just to the rear of the crossmember I think. There just isn't enough clearance above the top of the transmission case.

anamnesis

Is this clearer Guy? I bought my t9 stuff as a kit, and the gearbox separately. The v notch was already cut out of the plate when I bought my kit. It didn't need to be. But the supplier obviously figured it did. That shows why the dent in the crossmember in Alan's picture, will solve the rib problem. The metal you can see under the plate (between the v notch) is the bottom of my cross member. I only cut the top of it out, down to but not including the base of it. I always fit my g/box on its own. But with the pyramid mount cut off the extension as Alan shows, as you could if using the new bracket, then there wouldn't be the need to lift the tail as much, and it would slide in easily in the same way as the rib case does; with or without the engine attached.

anamnesis

Guy, I may have misunderstood. Are you saying your engine sits farther forward as a result of fitting your T9 gbox? I've been thinking. Lol. And researching/remembering. Our engines are positioned by the engine mountings. Unless one has altered those mountings, or their position, then irrespective of converting to a T9 gearbox or not, the engine should still be in its same factory fitted position. No farther foward or back. Hence the crank damper/pulley should be no closer to the front rack-bearing crosmember either. I fitted my T9 gearbox in the position dictated by my engine. The amount the gearbox penetrates into the tunnel, is dictated by the depth of the conversion bellhousing used/supplied. The modified propshaft is shortened accordingly. The gearbox mounting plate that came with the kit supplied to me, had a v notch cut in it for the gearbox tail support rib. Which suggests my supplier - who was TONY BOLTON, MOOR LANE GARARGE (MLG) expected the engine to sit farther back. Arie may have had dealings there too I think. But my gearbox doesn't sit back far enough, to justify such a deep v notch; or perhaps any notch at all. Now I think I know why. Moor lane garage billed themselves as the home of the K midget. MLG developed their T9 converion kits as an offshoot of their K Midget conversions. My guess is, that fitting the K engine dictates that the T9 gearbox sits farther back into the tunnel, and hence MLG's gearbox mounting plate needed notching to accomodate the gearbox tail support rib. Perhaps I was supplied with a 'K' plate. Or maybe he just supplied it as a universal plate, rather than make a separate one for non K fitment. A series, vs 1500 Triumph, vs K series. If converting to a T9 gearbox with the 1500 and A series engines, there shouldn't be any clearance issues with the crank pulley, and no need to cut the tunnel crossmember or the rib, or make such a large dent in the tunnel crossmember, if using this new style gearbox mounting bracket.

anamnesis

Ah ha. All the damper pulleys are the same thickness it seems. But what does make a difference is the radiator, cross or vertical flow. The later 1275s had the xflow rad, and a water pipe along the crossmember, mounted behind the rack. That can cause a clearance issue too. See picture I found of someones later Spridget and fan belt issue. I remember when I had my rwa midget, that it was a pig to even change the fan belt, and more difficult to lift the engine. But I replaced the steel water pipe with copper and that gave me a bit more clearance. On the earlier 1275s, the rack is mounted farther forward I think and most don't have the water pipe. I converted to a xflow rad, but made my own copper water pipe, so still don't have a clearance issue. I'd forgotten about the engine mount slots. I think my engine must be shifted rearwards a little then, to give me a full 9/16" clearance beteeen the crank pulley and front crossmember. But still the rib on the T9 gearbox doesn't penetrate the tunnel crossmember to much of an extent.

anamnesis

I cannot credit the originator as I do not recall where I pulled the picture from but this modification should assist engine fitting and extraction.

Alan Anstead

From Mike's link. It's a very neat job.

anamnesis

I should have made a note of the recipient that put the attached picture up. I could have asked if he had encountered any problems. I am assuming any ‘problem’ will be fore & aft location. Amongst the many T9 conversions that I have done in the past a couple were on 1500’s and I encountered no fitting problems. Whomsoever tapped the holes in my plate has got them all on the kilter so at some stage I will have to weld them then re-drill & tap square.

Alan Anstead

Rob, see my earlier post. Yep, it looks like a k/t9 box sits possibly appx an inch farther back into the tunnel. Hence the v notch (to accomodate the tailhousing suport rib) in my box mounting plate, -- supplied by moor lane garage,-- who developed their a-series t9 kit, from their k/t9 mated conversions.

anamnesis

Dave There does appear to be room to fit a captive nut onto the plate to allow for more thread engagement on the chassis fixing bolts subject to anything found when I find a T9 to dummy it upon. You can see that the cottonreel is set badly where the threads haven’t been tapped square. I am waiting on a reply from someone ahead in the game to see if he is willing to share his experiences. This is probably as far as I go at present as it is so bloody cold out in the garage.

Alan Anstead

This thread was discussed between 22/12/2024 and 09/01/2025

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