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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Steering Rack Inner Joint Play

Got an advisory at MOT today when the tester found play on the inner steering joint on one side. I will have a push/pull around myself before I do anything but have started to read around and check the options. Parts seem in short supply and pretty costly. No-one seems to hold shims. One option (once I have checked nothing is loose inside) would be to replace the rack. Prices of these seem very variable and I am concerned about quality.
Advice welcome please.
Graeme Williams

if just an advisory my advice is do nothing until next MOT.
David Smith

Graeme, I had the same problem at the last mot but as mine is used for classic rallying decided to fix it. It seemed easier to me to buy an exchange item from a reputable source (P May for example) than to try to fix it myself. Price was around £90 incl vat and p and p.
Note that depending on year there is a choice of two different racks but they are not interchangeable.
If you are not using the car much ,particularly over winter, and there is only little play then you may be happy to leave it a while.
IIRC it is a radiator out job and will take around 4 hrs for a semi competent spanner wielder!
There may be more satisfaction from doing the shimming yourself but equally it may be a pain in the exhaust.....others will know no doubt.
John S
J Sloan

worth saying that they are interchangeable as an assembly with trackrod ends and steering arms.
David Smith

...and mounting brackets.

Rather than shimming the ball joint, you can replace the track rod, complete with ball joint, assuming that the parts are available.
Dave O'Neill 2

Getting the bits seems to be the problem as the cost seems to be similar to a replacement rack, although some seem to be marked N/A. THanks for the comment about a rack from Peter May.

It's a Frog with a 1275 but the suspension has a negative camber. I am always wary about which bits are Mk 1 and which may have been swapped for a later part. How can I tell which of the two racks has been fitted?
Graeme Williams

GW,
Take a look at the Moss diags which show the differences.The early rack has a thicker middle section,different TREs and different fixing brackets.
You can get a new one from Morse but they don't seem to have any exchange units at present.
J Sloan

the early Morris rack - up to about 1972 - is very thick, very heavy and uses cast ally brackets. The later Triumph rack is thinner, much lighter and has pressed steel brackets. It's also slightly 'slower' in that there are more turns lock-to-lock.
David Smith

Frustrating, isn't it? I notice that Morris Minor factors - Charles Ware, for example - are offering reconditioned racks at reasonable prices; so they must have access to the shims, but it would be poor business to sell them to you for a few pence.
Nick and Cherry Scoop

Graeme,
I don't have a side by side comparison photo of the Morris and Triupmh racks but perhaps the photo and info below might help (perhaps?).

The photo is of my previous and existing Argentinian repro Triumph type steering racks. As you can see the repro wasn't all the same size but fitted with a bit of effort (not by me) but my steering rod seems odd so that didn't help I'd guess. The rubber gaiters on the new rack didn't last long.


Nigel Atkins

Check where any slack might be first. It isn't the MOT engineer's job to pinpoint exactly what the cause of the fault is. So it may be the inner TR joint, or it could be that adjustment of the lash between rack and pinion is needed- which is easier to do! Or if you are really lucky, it's just the rack clamp bolts that have worked loose!

If it is the inner ball joint that is slack, then wear is taken up by removal of shims so you may not need any additional parts. (though sometimes the ball seating also needs replacement) Although the job isn't complicated l do remember having a lot of difficulty undoing the screwed together components of the inner ball joint.
GuyW

A close up photo which might(?) help you identify your rack(?).

I think on the previous rack it reads "Brit.PAT. No C75(?)5(?)111 -


Nigel Atkins

Taking the inner TR joint apart does need access to a couple of special tools in my experience. It can be done of course but good to have a well sourced workshop. The inner TR's do pop up occasionally (NOS QH usually) but tend to be expensive.
I agreed with Guy worth checking all the other parts of the steering /rack first.
Bob Beaumont

Alternative source of a new rack is from MGBhive at £130 (incl vat).They also have a pic of a rack on the site. If you have the time you can take your rack out ,take a pic and send it to one of the helpful suppliers to match up. Or try Sussex classic car parts as they should be close enough for you to pop around and compare racks.
J Sloan

Thanks everyone for your help, for the pics and advice. My first step will be to slip off the rubber boot and see if there is anything obvious.
Graeme Williams

I'm also hunting play in the steering, somewhere. Not mentioned in here is to make sure the clamp bolt on the bottom of the steering column is done up tightly.

Mines either in rack/pinion backlash, or inner joint. Only tiny, but discernable. I can't think why it's worn out....
Rob Armstrong

The easisg way to determin early or late rack is look at the rubber gaitors...

if there both the same on both sides its an early rack

If the racks are 2 differant sizes and are not interchangeable...then its a later rack

I built my rack severwl years ago..taking them apart is a total bitch... you will need a oxy actylene torch and a huge pipe wrench and a vice to open them up

The draw back on a replacement is thsts what it is, they simple pull it off a parts car wash it and sell it as is ... at least you got parts

Try youtube, for chicagoland MG rack rebuild for a MGA

Its the same rack in apperance as the early rack..its just a bigger rack but its the exact same procedure and apperance as the midget early rack

Prop
1 Paper

I had the same advisory on an MOT a while ago. While looking at all the options, I phoned Kiley-Clinton and asked what it might cost to have my own rack rebuilt. Basic rebuild would be £75 + £12 carriage + VAT, but it will cost extra if the rack bar needs to be replaced.
Jonathan Severn

I can highly recommend Kiley Clinton, as a satisfied customer.
Dave O'Neill 2

Are these any good to you?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MG-MIDGET-1961-1972-NEW-PAIR-TIE-ROD-ASSEMBLY-RW62B-/271999733929?hash=item3f547290a9:m:mk1vQdxkalOH6AkVDNy3TyQ
b higginson

Someone's having a laugh at that price!
GuyW

And having a laugh about being new and unused?
Peter Blockley

These have been around for a while, Not suprising at that price!(although some one appears to have bought a pair recently I see)They are QH made units not BMC.
Bob Beaumont

They def don't look "unused". As for price, the rods generally seem to be "not available" and the other bits mount to £85 per side! So they are not "overpriced" if new, of course.
But I can buy a new rack for £130-ish and and exchange for around £80.

Graeme Williams

I found LHD Morris Minor racks (which is what a RHD Midget rack is) to be cheaper (for a new one). Go figure!!!
I bought one for the Sprite I'm restoring from Andrew Eggleston? and saved a lot compared with MOSS.

Rob
MG Moneypit

Interesting that is the LHD that fits. Presumably it fits the other way up.
Graeme Williams

Graeme,

The Spridget has the rack in front of the axle whereas the MM has it behind so resulting in opposite operation.
David Billington

THanks David, never thought of it like that.
Graeme Williams

This thread was discussed between 16/10/2017 and 23/10/2017

MG Midget and Sprite Technical index

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