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MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Windshield to Body Seal

Another posting regarding windshield installation. My apologizes.

I have looked through many archived discussions but could not find the answer to this question. Does the top lip of the seal go into the front groove under the windshield frame or overlap on the outside of the frame?

The photo shows the original seal that was removed when the car was disassembled and the new seal purchased a few years ago from Moss. In front of the "bulb" you can see how much thicker the new seal is than the original, in both the vertical and horizontal planes. Once the bulb is compressed the solid rubber will stand between the frame and the body. I think the additional rubber is making it difficult to push the frame into the correct position.

I have checked with Moss, and while the seal I have is not exactly like the seal they currently sell, for all practical purposes the dimensions are the same and they assure me I have the correct seal.

When I attempted to install the windshield and put more and more downward pressure on it, the seal actually extended out to the windshield wiper bezels and began to ride up over the bezels.

There is no question that the top lip of seal I took off the car was installed in the front groove under the windshield frame. I wonder if the new seal is designed to be installed over the outside of the frame? The top lip easily fits over the frame and when downward pressure is applied the seal rides up on the frame and may not extend as far forward on the body as when the lip is trapped under the frame.

For those of you who have been through this how is the seal on your car installed? Is it over or under and was it difficult align the bolt holes?

Thanks,
Paul



Paul Noeth

Any good? Took this today. Seal goes under frame.Your new seal looks like it's on steroids compared to the original one. Are you sure it's correct? Not the first time I've found this, I bought a pair of door seals from Moss and I couldn't close the door, so I took them back and bought a pair of original spec ones. More expensive of course.

Bernie.


b higginson

Hi Paul,
My original windscreen seal and the new one I fitted were both under the lip and the leading edge, once tightened, was just upto the wiper bezel seal.
No way would the screen fit back with hand pressure, so I made up a length of threaded bar (hooked at both ends)with three cable tightening gizmos. (these have a left-hand and right hand thread, which opens or closes when turning the centre section with a screw driver.
This fitted over the lower bolt at the top and under the lower door hinge at the bottom.
Worked a treat!
Tony




Tony G

Wiper bezel seal


Tony G

My tightening gizmo


Tony G

Lower fixing


Tony G

beware the rubbish rubber - my pillar seal rubbers, the ones that go under the body seal both cracked and curled within 18 months
Nigel Atkins

Just to slightly hijack this thread, i'll be refitting my screen this weekend. I was wondering if there'd be any point in running a bead of screen sealant along the length of the main screen to body seal and also under the pillar seals?
graeme jackson

Tony, your tightening gizmo... what a brilliant idea. Did you do one side at a time or did you make two and draw both sides down together? You mention that you used three turnbuckles. You lost me there. I am assuming that the photo was taken after the fact and that you hooked into the lower bolt hole, drew the frame down, installed the upper bolt, and then installed the lower bolt after removing the gizmo. Is that right?

Everything I have read is about different methods to force the windscreen frame into place. That indicates to me that the oversize seal is what is commonly being sold. I don't like the idea of forcing a fat piece of rubber into a space designed for a slender piece. And in my case it is riding up over the wiper bezels which is not acceptable to me.

Does anyone know where a proper sized seal can be purchased?

Graeme, after trying to install mine I would not recommend running sealant under the seal. The windscreen is not going to go in easily, the seal curls under and needs to be pulled forward while seating the windscreen and I think sealant would be smeared everywhere except where you want it.

The pillar seals might be a different story. I think a bead around the hole in the body and on the top side of the pillar seal may be helpful. I would like to hear what others think about that.

Paul


Paul Noeth

I used a small amount of sealant below the pillar seals - then fitted the screen down - even with the correct seal it is difficult with a new seal as it curls back underneath itself.

I had assistance to push down on the top centre of the screen and used the 'podger' (taper end bar) in the mounting holes on one side to pull down enough to get the first bolt in - then similar on the other side. Forcing the front lip seal out with a soft plastic strip and keeping it pressed down.

When all finally bolted up I lifted the seal edge and injected a little mastic to seal the front edge.

There is a correct mastic for windscreens - its a black material, which can be cleaned up with white spirit so fairly paint friendly - think Moss sell it.

R.
richard boobier

And my ratchet strap version, as posted here previously.
(sorry for mobile phone picture quality!)


Guy Weller

I used the ratchet strap technique as well, having read about it here. I don't think you would ever get the screen down without some mechanical help. I've done both the midget and an MGB - same for both.

As for sealant, I put lots of non-setting black windscreen sealant on both sides of the square gaskets at the legs, but none at all under the screen frame. Excess sealant squidges out round the legs and is easily wiped up with white spirit. No rain ever got under the screen.
Mike Howlett

Hi Paul, only made one gizmo and needed the three turn/tightening thingys to get the length and places to turn and tighten with a screwdriver in the door shut.
Used a short bolt in the bottom hole of the frame and as you say got the top bolt in once the screen was in place.
Only needed a smear of waxoyl on the screen seal and a flat putty knife to keep the seal from turning under.
Once I had made the gizmo, it only took 1/2 an hour to get the screen into place!
Regards, Tony


Tony G

Tony, thanks again for the photo. Now I understand how your device was assembled. I also like Guy's ratchet strap technique, mostly because I own a couple of the straps already.

I am still not keen on using the fat rubber seal. I got this one from Moss and to see if there is any difference, I'll order one from VB unless someone can recommend another place that might have the correct one. I imagine at this point they all come from the same manufacturer.

Given that I will probably have to use the oversize seal, I am thinking that good lubrication between the seal and the body will be helpful. As the rubber is compressed it will need to spread out, and reducing the friction between the seal and the body will help. Is there anything better than WD-40 for this?

One more question, the windscreen has been off a long time, about 10 years. I don't remember, is there a gasket between the center bracket and the cowl or does it bolt directly down to the painted surface?

Paul



Paul Noeth

Paul,

There is a 'centre packing AHA7779' between the bracket and the top of the scuttle.
As I recall its a charcoal coloured, very dense / hard sort of compressed paper gasket material - say 1/16" ish thick.

R.
richard boobier

Reviving this thread to report on the windshield seal issue.

Scarborough Faire sells a seal (part# AHA7698) that is nearly the same as the original from my MkII. See photo. Seal A is the original. Seal B is the one from Scarborough and Seal C is from Moss. I can imagine that seal B would look more like seal A after it has been installed for 47 years. (Northwest Import Parts also carries seal C for the Midget, but indicated that they may carry seal B in the future.)

Although Moss has assured me that the seal I got from them is correct, it does not fit as well as seal B. Seal C was much more difficult to install in the frame. The top lip of seal B (the seals are photographed upside down on a table) slipped into the front groove of the frame naturally. The top lip of seal C had to be forced in.

When seal B was installed in the frame about 3” of excess had to be trimmed off. When seal C was installed in the frame about 10” had to be trimmed off. The additional amount of rubber in the center area of seal C, and the additional length, leads me to believe that seal C is not the correct one for a MkII.

However, the new seal did not solve my windshield installation problems. I’ll start a new thread for that.


Paul Noeth

This thread was discussed between 27/02/2013 and 15/03/2013

MG Midget and Sprite Technical index

This thread is from the archive. The Live MG Midget and Sprite Technical BBS is active now.