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MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG Midget and Sprite Technical - Wishbones

I need to buy a pair of wishbones for my build, which of the usual MG parts sellers has the best ones as they all have different prices, with the MGOC being the dearest and Sussex Classic Car being the cheapest especially as they come with a fulcrum pin.
Martyn Wilks

is there more than a single manufacturer then? Sussex and all the other regional retailers will source through Moss. I suppose MGOC are big enough to commission their own supplier but can't think of anyone else now that Barry King has retired.
David Smith

I don't know if there are more than one manufacturer, BMH list one which Moss list but it is not available at the moment.

Moss offer a new alternative which is £60.12 each as opposed to the BMH one which has a price tag of £135.00.

The MGOC ones are listed at £74.96 and the Sussex Classic Cars is £67.31 including the fulcrum pin which is another £7+ at the other suppliers.

I don't necessarily want to buy the cheapest, I would much prefer to buy the best, however I don't want to pay £74 when the same item is £61 with the fulcrum pin.
Martyn Wilks

Buyer Beware.
Last year I bought a wishbone from Sussex M.G.

On the bench I found that the faces the the cork gaskets sit upon were far from sqare.
The trunnion and its corresponding threads were full of swarf.
I sent it back together with a sub standard stub axle.

It might be worthwhile specifying BMH and getting them from MGOC.
Dry fit on a bench to ensure all is correct.

Alan
www.masckent.org



Alan Anstead

Blimey Alan that's not good at all I wouldn't want that on my car.

I don't think the MGOC ones are BMH as they list them as "wishbone new" with a part no. of AHA7029 (I am going to phone them)

Moss is the only company that lists the option of a BMH made product - but with no stock.

I have a pile of parts for powder coating and would like to get the wishbones in with all my other bits and pieces.
Martyn Wilks

Just spoken with the MGOC and their wishbones are made by SCP (Specialist Car Products) in Telford and they are actually £89.95 each including VAT - the others are inclusive of VAT so it does make them quite pricey in comparison.

However if the one in the picture that Alan posted is an example of a cheap one I know which one I prefer.
Martyn Wilks

I wonder what happened to the original/final (wishbone) tooling/jigs that became BL's property before BL was wound up? Did British Motor Heritage secure the tooling?

I see that SCP is run/owned by two gents, Mr Belt and Mr Jeffery. An interesting company for anybody who wants to do a bit of Googling. UK business #1690048.

Although I can't substantiate the following, I have a hunch (now that Barry King has pulled out of supplying wishbones) that there are only two wishbone manufacturers in the world, namely a source from the far east (China), and SCP. But I could well be wrong.

Can anybody confirm either way?

Andy Hock

wheels within wheels!
So one director is also involved with Tech-Del (who make Minilites) and KN (who make Minators) and Revolution!
Now, what's the phone number of the Monopolies Commission?
And both directors are the only shareholders and are both around retirement age, one might be concerned for the future?
Couldn't see a Telford connection though - only Faygate and Cardiff...
David Smith

Yes, fascinating stuff - it would be an understatement to say that wishbone manufacture/supply is a niche industry LOL.

As British Motor Heritage oversee/authorise bodyshells, it would be reasonable to assume that they produce wishbones too(?) It wouldn't take much to convince me that some wishbones are imported from China. That might explain the tales of woe surrounding quality issues of some currently being sold in the UK.

Andy Hock

I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that the poor wishbones are solely Chinese as SCP has been discussed here before with regards to them producing new Armstrong dampers of very variable quality and often lacking the basic ability to pass the mounting bolts through the body. No reason to think they would do a better job with what I would consider a simpler item, such as a wishbone.

Does Peter Caldwell have a reconditioning service for new Armstrong LAs.
David Billington

SCP appear to have an address in Telford, as well as in Tamworth, Staffs.
Dave O'Neill 2

Re. SCP. Two thoughts:

Do we know for sure that they manufacture wishbones, or do they import them?

I thought Moss-UK bought the Armstrong tooling and/or site several years ago? Did Moss-UK then sell it on to SCP?
Andy Hock

Is this the same SCP that make KN Minilites? I've got a set of those and they seem good enough.

http://www.scp-uk.com/
Lawrence Slater

see your own link! (para 2)
David Smith

Attachment shows the item (F34) on the BMH website so I guess they do make them in house, but Moss have no stock of them.

http://www.bmh-ltd.com/testlayout.htm

I am going to buy the MGOC ones today as they have 11 in stock
Martyn Wilks

Didn't see that. So they are the same. If the wishbones are crap then, maybe their standards have slipped.
Lawrence Slater

It's a shame none of the owners clubs (or a consortium of all of them) made the decision to take over Barry's operation. The TR register are heavily involved in ensuring supply of good quality critical parts.

Jeremy Cogman

the snag Jeremy is that MGCC have never got involved in parts manufacture, restricting their sales to regalia-type products as a matter of policy; the MGOC already sell wishbones and probably don't see the need for a premium product, MASC is probably too small to cover the investment needed. The manufacturing process is a bit too 'industrial' to be done from a double garage at home.
David Smith

Did anyone take up the Barry King design?
Perhaps a job for JLH minors, who was doing a design for stub axles wasn't he?
aj robinson

David, Indeed. I'm not surprised by the OC not getting involved, it's not what they are and MASC are of ocurse too small on their own I wasn't aware of that policy of the CC's and it's a shame. The TR-R do some great work in this area for their owners and it's a shame none of the MG clubs have the same vision.

I guess it's needs a pretty heavy press to stamp out the main wishbone. A club needn't get its hands dirty. It could buy the operation and then give it to a commercial organisation to run in return for an ongoing members discount or maybe a licence fee back to the club.

Alternatively perhaps the clubs should be lobbying the likes of AH Spares, Peter May, B&G to take on the operation.

Presumably it was a viable business for Barry, with good marketing it could be again. Done right you should be able to annihilate the inferior ones from the market.
Jeremy Cogman

Interesting idea Jeremy and agreed it's a shame there isn't a consortium doing the same as the TR owners.
Just to add to the mix Peter May does offer new wishbones
see http://www.petermayengineering.co.uk/catalogue1.htm#catalogue1 - item 1.20.1
I wonder if he manufacturers them or buys them in as I thought most of what he offers he produces himself e.g. clutch roller release bearings?
Jeremy Tickle

Hopefully this little set will restore a wishbone. I dont know its origins.
Alan


Alan Anstead

How did you come to find that Alan?
Lawrence Slater

AJ Robinson, our uprights are specific to our coil over kit, so not compatible with the standard wishbones.


J L HEAP

It came from the estate of a late friend John Larrington. John owned a Frogeye.
If only we could source them wishbones could be repaired without going to suppliers.
I have a wishbone that these are destined for.
Alan
Alan Anstead

It's a mystery Alan. MGBhive sell reconditioned wishbones, amongst others, so the bushes must be available from somewhere.
Lawrence Slater

Alan,

Are those bushes pre-tapped for the trunnion thread? I've been told in the past that the proper rebushing technique was to use blank bushes, maybe with the grease cap thread in, and then tapped through with a special coaxial tap which will cut threads in both bushes at the same time and inline.

Anyone got any idea what the threads are, they look sort of BSF like. Regarding trunnions the quality ones I have seen are a ground finish thread, the cheaper ones left with the heat treatment discolouration on the outside.
David Billington

Its not so long ago that the bushing sets were available from the usual suspects. Maybe 10 years at most. They are supposed to be braised in, not welded. I planned to refurbish some wishbones as it would have been much cheaper, but chickened out as it is something of a critical part.

I remember reading that the stepped tap was essentially to clean out the threads rather than to cut new ones.
But the reason I remember that detail was I doubted it at the time. Not only must the bushes be in line, but the start point of the threads in the two parts need to be correct relative one to the other.

I don't think the thread is a conventional one of any sort. The sides of the threads seem to be too angular. I believe the principle purpose of the "thread" is to increase the contact surface area of what is essentially intended to be a bearing.
Guy W

The bushes are tapped to accept the trunnion pin.
Alan


Alan Anstead

Guy is right of course, the 'thread' is really a threaded shape so that the pivot loading is spread across a wider area than just an inch or so of pivot

Maybe Peter May has decent stuff, most of his sales items I've seen have been of excellent quality
Bill sdgpM

Alan,

I queried it because I can't see if there is a thread in the bushes in either photo. While it looks like there might be a thread in the left hand bush it isn't clear enough to be certain in either image. Maybe the bushes are partly pre-machined and then tapped to clean out I think that is a bit different to a fully machined bush that has to be aligned with a trunnion pin while it is being brazed in.
David Billington

It is sad that the fabrication skills. experience, design and toolings for the Barry King standard and updated wishbones is at risk of being lost, following production ending.

It reminds me of the story of respected maker of race and custom exhausts - Mike the Pipe - tubular exhaust manifold jigs ending up in a skip.

As had been said previously, is this was for a Mini it is just the thing Minispares would have secured the production and supply for.

Is there no fabricator out there in midget BBS land or Sebring Sprite land that does not fancy a side project for wishbone manufacture in seasonal burst during downtime? Sounds like something worth crowdsourcing to help finance both the buyout from Barry King (including getting key info/training on how manufactured as well as designs and tooling), sub-component manufacture but also some orders.

Cheers
Mike
M Wood

David
The components of the kit in assembled form.

Mike
The same goes for the tooling etc of the Frogeye Motor Co once run by Keith Brading on the Isle of Wight.
It is a pity that and the Barry King wishbone manufacture are to be lost.


Alan Anstead

I sent the Barry King details to Chris Buckenham, he of the now reproduced FWB's, when I first heard the BK kit and caboodle was up for sale.

But I guess he wasn't interested in taking it on. Although I don't know if he even followed it up, or even received the details I sent him for that matter.

Does anyone have a direct email address for Chris Buckhenham?
Lawrence Slater

I think the purpose of the thread is not to increase the area but rather it provides a simple solution to providing radial and axial location without having to control widths accurately. In a situation like I made the width between which the top hat bushes fit and the bottom of the kingpin width have to be accurately controlled, the OE kingpins were ground to width but they went out of production shortly after I bought the last set and all new kingpin AFAIK are left as forged on the side at the bottom so would have to be machined.

I did meet a guy some years back that had apparently converted quite a few wishbones to use Triumph Spitfire lower trunnion bits, I suspect in an arrangement like mine.


David Billington

This thread was discussed between 28/01/2016 and 06/02/2016

MG Midget and Sprite Technical index

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