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MG MGA - Historic vehicle status
I am not sure whether has been discussed before but here goes, about 2 years ago I changed my 1600cc engine and 4 speed box for an 1800cc MGB engine and 5 speed Ford type 9 box. I have told my insurance company who were cool but not the DVLA. I seemed to read very conflicting information. Comments please on my options and the rules. Thanks
If you can get hold of the June Safety Fast there is a flowchart which leads you to a solution and some special pleading.
|I think that you're OK with the engine upgrade, but the 5-speed addition may be causing the issue since its not original to the car and is derived from a different model of vehicle. You can reach out to the "British Historic Vehicle Clubs" organization and get some direction from them as to your particular situation; here's their link & contact info:|
Tel: 01708 223111
|I think you must tell the DVLA of the change in engine capacity, together with the new engine number. |
When my V8 went from 3.5 to 3.9 it was a requirement and also the new number had to have confirmation from a VOSA centre or, on headed paper, from a reputable garage. They didn't appear bothered by the gearbox change to LT77.
I informed the DVLA when I changed to the 1800. They were not the slightest interested, nor with the engine number. They said as long as it was same style of engine don't bother to tell them in future if I swap around.
|In a question and answer in a magazine somewhere I read that changing a gearbox or back axle ratio is considered OK. There is no mention of either in the guidance notes.|
Changing to a 5 speed can be argued as permissible as it is "improving the environmental performance of the vehicle" throgh better mpg.
|Many thanks. Once I can read the engine number I will set wheels in motion.|
That's very strange indeed, as engine capacity and it's number are recorded on the V5. Plus, if numbers don't match people get a touch suspicious should you want to sell. As I said the DVLA insisted on independent confirmation of the engine capacity AND it's number. When were your dealings with Swansea?
When I first contacted them telling them I had changed to an 1800 they asked for an engine number. I managed to 'obtain' one but when I then contacted them with the number they said the policy had changed and they did not want it. They said something along the lines that with historic cars it was acknowledged that a lot of water had gone under the bridge in 40+ years and original bits will have got changed or not now be available. It was not worth their time and effort tracking data that did not have current coding for modern tracking systems. In future I did not need to tell them of capacity change nor engine numbers.
This is what they put in my logbook.
Thanks for your help. How did you contact them. I was thinking I would need to send the log book with the new info. Also when was this?
Looking back over my previous communications from 2011, they noted my engine size change but were not interested in the engine number and the trouble I went to get one, plus an inspection by Bob West to verify the change and the safety of the installation. They stated this: " Because of the relative small number of cars involved we are not interested in the engine size nor engine number as we are aware of the untraceable engine swaps that must have been carried out in historic cars over the past 50 to 100 years."
|Seems to me Steve, it's all down to who you happen to talk to at the time. My communication with them was 3 years after you!! Right hand and left hand and knowing!!|
|My car which was imported from the USA around 13 years ago and registered here once it had been restored.
In the Log-book it states that the engine size is 1950cc whilst in actual fact, it was actually supplied at the time with an engine which had a capacity of 1840cc.
I have since corrected the Log-book by changing the engine for one with an actual capcity of 1950cc.
I suppose I should really now apply for the exemption from the MOT test that the car is now entitled to, but I have not rushed to do this as I still intend taking the car for it annual MOT test.
I do between 3 and 5 thousand miles per year in my MGA and I think it is good to really know that the brakes etc are up to the task.
Declaration of exemption from the MoT is self certification on the DVLA form V112. You simply download it, fill it in, declaring your car as category O and keep a copy handy. I keep it in the car. I presumed it needed to be sent to the DVLA but they did not want to know. They just sent it back telling me to keep it available for inspection should the situation arise.
I will sort it out sometime next week.
|When I taxed my car a few months ago the email notification said MOT required for my 1958 car. I just went through the on line tax process and it accepted it despite me not having an MOT at that time so presumably it just said 1958 car so not required.
By the way it is now MOTed again a couple of days after new regime came in. I always note my brake test results and this time I also asked the tester how they were by modern standards and surprisingly he said they were better than many modern cars. By the way I think my Golf’s one much better.
|The v112 is for when you tax at a post office. If you tax online the computer should know you do not need a mot. The brake tests for modern cars has been updated and we now get our classic friendly garage to test the brakes with a calibrated Talley meter rather than the rollers , same as a lsd.|
|David k Brenchley|
|My test was done in the same way as before. What is a Talley meter and lsd?|
|Hi All. I have filled in the changes box in the log book and sent it to Swansea. I will keep you informed. I intend always to have the car mot ed just as a sanity check.|
|I think David means a Tapley meter.|
This device is an accelerometer or "G" meter..
Placed on the floor of the car and when driving and then braking it measures deceleration.
LSD is a limited slip differential.
|M F Anderson|
|My braking g meter is the passenger seat folding forward!|
|Mick is right. I blame predictive text thingy.|
|David k Brenchley|
|THis is an informative link:
It suggests that if your vehicle is over 40 years it will be regarded as MOT exempt until the next tax renewal at which point it will require an MOT unless you complete a V112 stating that it meets VHI exemption (I recall that is category "r"). Records available to police for vehicle checks will show mot exemption until that point.
Apparently Authorities won't accept the V112 prior to tax renewal.
That is my interpretation but to be sure read it yourselves.
When you do it on line the system never refers to nor asks for a V112. I ignore all the blurb about MoT that is standard format for the on-line renewal. Being doing it for a number of years. Never had any comeback of any sort. See my first post. To put it quite simply the DVLA is not interested in us. We are such a small percentage of their system. I keep a V112 in the car. It puts the onus on the owner. It says you don't need an MoT but it is a legal requirement to keep the vehicle in a roadworthy condition.
|I read the DVLA blurb the other day, it's so ambiguous.
All that stuff about "substantially modified" from standard is a farce. There aren't many 40+ year old vehicle that haven't been changed in some way or other. Then it goes on to give exemptions to that statement which seem to include modifications to increase safety plus others which included "environmental impact". Presumably this would include brakes, lights, steering, suspension, tyres; i.e., most of the things which do get substantially modified!!!
|Category O :-|
Vehicles with a maximum design speed of less than 15.5 mph!
|Dave O'Neill 2|
An update. I sent off my log book off a couple of weeks ago and gave them the new 1800cc engine number and capacity change.The log book was returned today with new info added and no change to the Historic status and no question asked or demands for invoices or engineers reports.
This thread was discussed between 05/06/2018 and 28/06/2018
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