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MG MGA - Lucas PL 700 headlamps

At a recent show, I purchased a set of Lucas Tripod headlamps. Installed them a few weeks ago and all seemed well. I took my first night ride tonight and was eager to give them a "real conditions" test. No go.

On low beams they shine far ahead and illuminate distant trees and telephone poles--but on low beam intensity. When I switch to high beams, great amounts of very bright light illuminate ten feet in front of me and the distant trees along with most everything else goes dark! I pulled one when back in the garage and the bulb can only go in one way due to a locating tab. Also, the headlamp bucket can only go on the car one way too, and its correct. The only part I can see that could be moved is the internal reflector inside the Tripod itself. Currently, its on the top half of the fixture with the opening downward. Is this right?

This issue happens to be on my '64 MGB but not many B's use the Tripod and thought there would be more exposure to them with the A folks. Any thoughts?

Thanks--Paul

Paul Hanley

Paul,
Are they real triposd? I have read where the reproduction tripods are not very good. Another thought is that they may be european units.
mike parker

Sure sounds like they are upside-down. Don't see how that's possible though since they have the Lucas badges on them which makes it pretty difficult to accidently install that way.
Steve Simmons

Mike, European units as in "Dip left or right"--rhd vs lhd? Not the issue--this is clearly an up and down thing. And yes, they are repro's. They look pretty good as I had heard there were quality issues but I perceived those issues to be more cosmetic than functional---perhaps I'm wrong. I think my info comes from a Moss Catalog disclamer.

Steve, you actually can't install any headlamp upside down as the three locating tabs are not equal distant, insuring proper placement--with the badges as a bonus to the mentally challenged!

I think I'm overlooking something simple or they are just defective.
Paul Hanley

Or they are just crappy lamps. If Moss would allow it I'd be willing to drive up there and test a set of lamps for you to see if the performance is the same.
Steve Simmons

Thanks for the offer Steve. And what a great drive that is...likely one of the best in the US...Hwy 1 along the ocean to Santa Barbara...I miss that road. Only issue is they are not from Moss but another supplier. I've emailed him and he's on it!

As I've described above, there's is a cut out on the internal shield/baffel. The opening/cutout is facing down. Maybe someone with a known good set could check to see whether their cutout is facing up or down. Thanks!

Paul
Paul Hanley

Paul,

I started the thread a while back about the poor quality reproduction PL700s, spoke to Moss as Barney Gaylord forwarded them to me, and as a result there's a disclaimer in the catalog, even though Moss didn't sell the lamp units to me but I believe they are the same manufacture. Your findings about the lack of focus parallels my experience. I had to go to brights to dim the lights to oncoming traffic and they did have the left hand drive pattern lens that is supposed to dip the beams to the left. It was an expensive and wasteful purchase. I even installed halogen bulbs which only increased the scattered light. Are the back of the lamp units varnished the typical brown-green color of Lucas lamps? All the reproduction units I've seen have unvarnished silver backs and the lens fluting isn't precisely cut, although it follows the original pattern. - M.S.
Martin Straka

Are you sure that high and low aren't reversed at the switch or where they connect to the unit? I don't actually know if that is possible.
John

Original Lucas tripod lamps are quite good. There sre more than one repro model available, none known to be as good as the originals, and some are worse than others (some a lot worse). For reviews and supplier response check here: http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/faulty/ft013.htm

Barney Gaylord
http://MGAguru.com
Jim Paul

All,

Martin's advise regarding the reproduction PL-700's is sound and fortunately word is getting around to avoid them regardless of cost! Speaking of cost, I see that they are now selling for as little as $35.00 per lamp. You can tell the fakes from the originals in several ways. The first is that back of the lamp is silver and not a bronze gold color. The fluting of the lens is very dull versus a very sharp and distinct fluting on the originals. Lastly the three locators that register with he headlamp buckets or located incorrectly. The downside to all this is that the light produced is horrible and totally unsafe to the driver and on coming vehicles. However the original PL-700 are wonderful lamps. Even more so when equipped with H4 halogen bulbs. I have a set on My MGA and they still look like new after twenty years. The downside of the original PL-700's is that they are now very hard to obtain and costly. Expect to pay between $300-400 for a set.
Don Tremblay

Even the original PL-700s weren't that great by modern standards. In the 1950s headlight design was a combination of seat-of-the-pants engineering and a little sliderule work. Modern lights, with their computer-designed compound reflectors, etc., are spoiling us. It sounds like in Paul's case, however, the bulb is not sitting at the focus point of the parabolic reflector. This needs to be set within a few millimeters of the lamp will display the kind of erratic behavior indicated here. Probably sloppy manufacturing tolerances. At least the originals didn't suffer that.
David Breneman

Hey not to sidetrack this thread, but I didn't write the post above with the link to Barney Gaylord's site (although it is a great site). This has happened a couple of times before...I've seen posts with my name on them and thought, "huh? I didn't post that message!"

Somehow this forum saves and transposes user ID and info? Was it Barney who posted that link but somehow my name appears to the left? I'm confused how this is happening.

Anyway for what it is worth I had a pair of PL700s on my old MGB over ten years ago and their light output was unsatisfactory...focus problems and weak output although that was with original bulbs.
Jim Paul

Hey, sorry about that, Jim. Yes, apparently the BBS system errantly inserts an incorrect member name when the correspondent is not a member.

I have long since registered as a member, but sort of forgot about it. I have not been a regular visitor here (but might change that). Occasionally someone sends me a link to check a note here. When I go directly to that link I end up here as a non-member (just not logged in).

I will endeavour to log in for future posts. I think I'm logged in this time. We'll see how it works.

Barney Gaylord
1958 MGA with an attitude
http://MGAguru.com
B Gaylord

Barney,

It's great to have you weigh in on this matter and hope you do indeed visit here more.

Everyone,

The backs of my new lamps are painted brownish green and the tripods are in perfect position within the glass. In addition, they fit into the locating groves on the buckets 100% on the money. Glass fluting is very good. Only issue, is that I can't see at night. I know, picky, picky, picky. Can't have everything! I believe the internal optics (reflector) are horribly off. I did double check the wiring installation even though my old sealed beams worked as they should...never know. I'm sure of one thing: The supplier that provided them is talking to his people and in the end, we will reach a satisfactory solution.

Thanks for everyone's help and advise.

Paul

btw Barney G--awsome web page on these devises.
Paul Hanley

Paul, I put a set of repro tripods on the ZBV a couple of years ago and have concluded they are worthless for night driving. The beam's only usefulness is that most other cars can sort of see you. They certainly don't illuminate the road. Mine do better on high than low but they are still pretty sad. To add insult, the chrome started pitting several months after I had them on the car.

They do look cool, though. The pitted chrome matches the rest of the original 47 year old chrome.
Wray

Another issue with this site is that if you are logged in and copy the page address to use as a link elsewhere, the link will log anyone who uses it into the site as you! Further, your user ID is displayed in the link which can be used to compromise your account here. It's just a matter of old software, really.
Steve Simmons

This thread was discussed on 07/04/2005

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