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MG MGA - Overtaking mirrors

Hi guys, I've just had a nice day at Stoneliegh mg parts day.
Managed to get a few bits including some side screens so happy bunny,
The only thing I didn't get was some mirrors for my MGA
I would like to put two mirrors one either side fitted to the windscreen posts.
Has anyone done this and what mirrors did they use and where did you get them ?
I spoke to a guy at the show who said there is an MGA guy by the name of Peter Robinson who has designed and made special brackets for this type of mirror fitment, can anyone help.

Cheers Jack.
Jack New Forest

Frank

These are mine: http://www.mgaroadster.co.uk/Mirrors.htm

I got one bracket from Bob West. I made the other one up myself and got it chromed. I used the stanchion to windscreen set screws to secure in place. I am aware that others do something similar. Fair bit in the archives. In practice I found the passenger side bullet mirror I now have installed totally useless. I am unable to set it to the acute angle needed. I just use it for symmetry and for the wife to scare herself.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Jack
I personally havent come across the name of Peter Robinson in MGA circles but possibly the guy at Stoneleigh meant Simon Robinson whos MGA parts and restoration business was based around the NE of England.
Unfortunately, Simon passed away last year and so I am not certain if the business is still operating.

Im glad you are going for the windscreen frame mounted side mirrors, they work really well whereas the wing mounted mirrors are pretty useless.

I would check out Moss or Bob West to see which are the best.

Colyn
c firth

Sorry, meant Jack!!
Steve Gyles

Thanks Colyn and Steve, very helpful, I need to crack on with this as I need to fit so that I can use my MGA safely, I'll try Bob West tomorrow then Moss.
Sorry about the name mixup and so sorry to hear he has passed on.

Jack.
Jack New Forest

Jack

I think Bob may be closed on Mondays as he works all Saturday.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Ok Steve, thanks, got to get this sorted, can't wait to get the girl out across the New Forest.
Jack New Forest

Jack,
I have got Desmo oval mirrors fitted to the windscreen pillars on both my MGA'S. They were supplied by Stafford Vehicle Electrics. He sells a modified ball mount with a hollow centre where you can put a screw to attach it to the wind screen pillar. The modified mounts are about £5.00 or £6.00 each.

Regards

David
D M SPEAK

Jack, I fitted oval mirrors to the screen pillars also. One of the screw holes picks up on an existing hole in the pillar whilst I simply drilled and tapped for the second screw.

Regards
Colin


Colin Manley

These work well.
D
D Smith

... Barney, as ever, has posted an illustration http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/accessories/at103c.htm
D Smith

Have had the MGOC Desmo oval mirror fitted on driver’s side since 2009. Looks good, works well & has never worked loose even though it is only secured with the single screw.

Richard



R A Evans

I have same set up as Richard. Very simple and it works well for me. I used some screw fastener fluid to ensure it didn't work loose.
Graham V

Jack
my present mirrors work really well and I think that they look great but unfortunately, they are bolted through the top edge of the aluminium door panel.
Also, because they are a little to near to the top edge, they interfere with the seating of the sidescreens when they are fitted and cause them to curl up at the front corner.

They were on the car when I bought it but if I was fitting them now, I would go for something that would fasten onto the windshield frame so that I could avoid drilling a hole through the aluminium.

Colyn


c firth

I made mirror mounts for the windshield posts that use wing mirrors. Mine are made out of stainless steel and polished. My first try was made out of thinner stock and vibrated a little so I remade some out of heavier material. Rock solid, don't interfere with side screen, and held on by one of the original screws.


Ed Bell

Thanks to all you guys for the help and ideas with mirrors, I've been in touch with Bob West, for my left hand drive car I wanted a mirror on the opposite side from driver so right hand side to assist with overtaking so I can see the traffic coming on my right hand side, the guy I spoke to was very helpful, but he suggested that the bracket was not so good for the right hand side as the windscreen pillar gets in the way, he suggested as many of you have, that the best solution was a Desmo type mirror which sticks out a bit further.

Some of you have sent me good pics of this type, so I'll give it a go.

While I'm online, I need to carpet the boot area, any suggestions on decent carpet set and who from ? I have some decent sound barrier felt I can use, but I don't want thin carpet, I saw some at Stoneliegh on Sunday but it was quite thin and cheap looking.
Thanks boys and I'll put up some pics when I fit the mirror.

Cheers
Jack.
Jack New Forest

Jack, Re: Boot carpets.

I recently sent a set back to Victoria British. Thin, stiff and not worth $100.00. It was from England so I suppose it's 'more original' but not at all to my liking.

The set I received from Moss was much better. Thicker, blacker!!!, better form fitting (but not perfect) and has a cover sewn in for the fuel pipe which is kinda nice. Much better, about the same price.
MAndrus

Jack,
For what it may (or may not) be worth, my understanding is that original MGA owners went 'commando', with no boot / trunk carpet.
D
D Smith

Yeh I wondered about that D
But everything in the boot will rattle and make a noise !
Jack New Forest

Yup, true commando ...
D Smith

Jack,
my car didn't have a carpet in the boot and so i looked at the mga guru site and printed out Barneys boot carpet diagram.
Then I went to a local carpet shop and tried to buy an off cut of black corded carpet. They refused to sell me any because it was too small to bother with. So they gave me a piece as it saved them from disposing of it themselves.

The corded carpet was only about 1/4" thick and cut easily with scissors.

Barney's diagram has very accurate measurements and once I cut it out and tried it in the boot it fitted perfectly.
I don't think that I cut out the 17 1/2" long slot that runs almost full width of the carpet just behind the spare wheel and I didn't fit the felt pads.

It took me less than 30 minutes and it looks great too.

Colyn
c firth

Sounds good Colyn, I'll have a look at that. Did you stick it down with adhesive ?
Jack New Forest

I justs sits onto the boot floor and doesnt need fastening down Jack.

If you look at Barneys carpet pages he mentions a section on Carpet templates, in section number INT 101B he can provide full size CAD template drawings of the boot carpet.
I dont know how you would print these, maybe you print them in A4 size sections and stick them together?

I just measured out and drew the shape on the back of the carpet (in reverse of course) and cut it out.

Colyn
c firth

Back to the original subject.

This is my solution to the problem, i.e. door mounted mirrors. They work very well, don't get in the way of side screens,and probably give a better view of the rear wings when reversing. The mirrors are a standard Moss product. I did without for years but in the end fitted for wet 'hood up' driving. I do now also use them for overtaking, and getting in and out of the garage when I want the car over as far as possible one side or the other.

In my earlier Coupe days I used wing mounted mirrors without any problems except I think they spoil the lines of the wings.

Nice to be driving again today after 2 weeks off for a hernia, it was only in the Golf though.

Paul


Paul Dean

The look a lot like the mirrors that were on my car when I got it Paul, do they catch a little on the bottom edge of the side screens though like mine do?

You are braver than I am if you drilled a hole through the aluminium door panel yourself, I probably wouldnt have been able to bring myself to do it.
(Sometimes a DPO comes in quite useful! ;-)

Colyn

PS Jack, its your thread, we dont mind if you change the subject :-)
(sorry Paul!)

c firth

Yes your right Paul, I should have started a new thread, saves confusion.
I like the mirror on the door Paul but I'm reluctant to drill into any part of the car, wings, doors, etc. I like the smooth lines.
I'm going down the road of fitting them to the windscreen posts, they look pretty good and functional.
Yes Colyn I think the weight of the carpet should keep it in place.

Thanks everyone for your input into this discussion, looking forward to my next questions, won't be long as I'm a new boy to MGAs
I know plenty about MGBGTs and midgets and Frogeyes, but I'm loving my MGA.

Cheers
Jack.
Jack New Forest

Jack,

I drove my MGA thousands of miles from London to Scotland in the '70's and then back and forward to Germany in the '80's, thoroughly enjoyable motoring of course!

One thing that bugged me and I never got around to sorting it was the original position of the right and left side wing mirrors, too far away to see properly and they would bend in the wind over 60 mph.

But it took me years to realize also that the position of the mirrors far out on the wings detracted from the beautiful flowing lines of the wings of the MGA.

After having the MGA off the road for 26 years, with the upcoming 60th anniversary, and keen to join the Stuart Mumby's Land's End to John o'Groats tour, I asked Bob West to consider a major renovation of all the mechanics and the interior. The body was still in good shape after major work in 1984.

I wanted to bite the bullet and re-position these dreadful wing mirrors; Bob was reluctant, trying to save me cost as we did not need to touch the body. However, after coaxing, he did the job, fitting his own wing mirror onto the windscreen pillar. What a superb improvement, looks great and works beautifully.

Personally I find any mirrors fitted to the top of the door also spoil the curved lines of the wing and door.

Here is a shot of the original mirrors as fitted when I bought the MGA in 1975. And a couple of pics. of Bob's mirrors on 2 MGAs at his workshop, the car with the cut-away windscreen is LBL 301.

Happy motoring in your MGA!

Doug




Doug Wallace

Bob West's wing mirror, left side on a right-hand drive MGA..

Doug


Doug Wallace

And on LBL 301, on the racing windscreen...

Doug


Doug Wallace

Jack,

Here is one of my MGA on LE-JoG, 768PMK, and Bob Cole's MGA YSU765, both cars have the same type mirror attached to the pillar, mine tilts upwards and Bob Cole's tilts down, possibly more discreet.

Cheers,

Doug


Doug Wallace

Great pics Doug, I spoke to someone at Bob Wests he said the bracket was not a great success as my car being left hand drive, when I put one on the right hand pillar for overtaking the pillar obstructs the view, but yours look fine, so I'm confused now.
He suggested the Desmo type ones which a few of the guys here have posted pics of.
Did your bracket come with a mirror ?
What mirror did you use ?

Cheers

Jack.
Jack New Forest

Have been following this thread with interest for some time now and, having an alternative view, thought I'd throw in my two pence. Attached pic shows my arrangement which really does work perfectly, both sides, no downsides, and in my personal view contributes to the look of the car rather spoiling it's lines, as some have suggested. It certainly can not be adversely compared with the various rather ugly window frame brackets that I have seen, which also place the mirror too close to the frame for the driver's view of the passenger side mirror, and can possibly conflict with other weather gear on the drivers side. The only point I have managed to agree with is the useless positioning of mirrors at a distance down the wings! You will see I also have a luggage rack which I also don't think spoils the car's lines! So there!
Best wishes. Bruce.


Bruce Mayo

Bruce, your mirrors look as is they are mounted in virtually the same place on the doors as both mine and Paul Deans and I agree that they are very effective in that position.

Unfortunately, on my car they have just been fitted about 1/4" too high and the mirror mounting causes the sidescreens lower seal to curl up a bit. I will probably modify the vinyl where it catches the mirror mount to sort this out.

Colyn
Colyn Firth

Yes see your point Bruce, but I'm trying to avoid drilling any hole I'm
In my bodywork.
Jack New Forest

Jack
Be brave! First thing is - be careful. No drill skid marks. Measure several times, then just do it. Once done you will forget your worries about drilling a hole in the door because it works so well and looks quite natural. Certainly better than brackets on the side frame and limited visibility on the passenger side and possibly also to an extent even to the rear on the drivers side.
Bruce.
Bruce Mayo

I have my mirrors on the doors too. Much better field of view p than on the wing, and they don't get in the way if you have to work on the engine. They are also both adjustable from the driver's seat - try that with them on the Wings!
dominic clancy

Jack

When I first installed the Bob West brackets I had the standard screen and side windows. The brackets extended forward so the mirror attachment bolt was out of interference way in front of the pillar. But this tended to obstruct the offside view a bit but not much I recall. When I went the sports screen route I swapped over the brackets so that the mirror hole was behind the pillar. Does not affect me as I don't use side windows but would interfere with the standard set up. Does that help with your confusion with Doug's set Up?

PS. My opinion is don't drill. Another hole to fill in aluminium at some stage in the future. There again I belive you said you already have Lifta dot studs on your Doors?

Steve
Steve Gyles

Jack

I agree with both Bruce and Dominic. Mine too are fitted on the doors and the visibility is excellent. However, whether I would have drilled the holes and installed mirrors in the door had it not already been done I am unsure. Certainly don't put them on the wings as adjustment is a non starter at least when you are driving.

My mirrors are bog standard circular mirrors so simple and effective. In the late 50's and early 60's the temptation as to fitting 'racing mirrors' was common. Would they be appropriate to an 'A'? Perhaps so and maybe their styling is more akin to the stylish clean lines of the A. Fittings to the windscreen pillar tend to lack style and if the side screen is up they would be more difficult to adjust when travelling compared with door fittings.

So go for the door fitting but consider the aesthetics between a circular mirror and perhaps a more stylish racing mirror, If you visit Paul Beck's Vintage Car Parts website he has a wide range of styles. The racing mirrors are primarily two bolt wing fitting which is not what you want. He includes several single bolt fittings (Type 790C is 100mm diameter, 90 mm deep in chrome and alloy and No 905 (Rear View Mirror_ Raydyot Pattern which is 100mm diameter with a single 7mm bolt fitting. They are all around £21-£25 each with VAT. You would though need to see what they are like when fitted and aesthetically are they for you!

All the best
Jerry
Jerry Birkbeck

A couple of points about my door fixed mirrors .

Firstly as my car is a long way from concourse and I know there is quite a bit of filler in one door and I replaced the skin on the other I am not too nervous about drilling holes in them. I can't see why if you want to do the job and you apply normal procedures starting with a small pilot hole there should be a problem. I do understand though people not wanting to touch perfect paintwork under any circumstances

Secondly mine are of an adjust and then fix arrangement so they never go out of adjustment hence adjustment on the move is a non issue. My driver's one is set for overtaking and the other a bit lower so I can also see my rear wing lower down as I mentioned before.

Last year despite fairly high Scottish miles I never put the hood up so hardly needed them. I was the only car to stay hood down on the MGCC Scottish MGA day.

Paul

Paul Dean

Well guys, lots of great feedback, but I have to say I'm getting more confused, not because of the comments but because, my car is left hand drive, the guy I bought it from had it resprayed but he took off a wing mirror and didn't refit it, see pic. I have two small holes, that I don't know what to do with.
Rather than try to fill them and have to paint the wing, I thought I would fit a bullet type racing mirror in this spot, now I know you have all told me not to fit wing mirrors, but I have to do something to cover the holes, and they are well up the wing towards the driving position on the left hand side.
As you will see from my second image I have fitted a pillar mirror just as a temporary item so that I can take the car out and be able to see cars coming up on my right hand side.
I do like the idea of the door mirror, and as suggested I think it keeps the lines a little better than he mirrors sticking out from the pillars.

Any help with the wing hole problem would be appreciated.


Cheers Jack.



Jack New Forest

And this is the temporary pillar mirror.


Jack New Forest

My vote goes to Barney's recommendation
http://www.mgaguru.com/mgtech/accessories/at103.htm
Mike
Mike Ellsmore

There is nothing wrong with fitting a wing mirror there Jack but it probably not be as effective as a door mounted (or door pillar mounted) one.

I would just fit a couple of grommets into the holes, ideally red ones and forget about them until you decide to have them welded up and re sprayed quite a few years along the road. Just make sure you put some paint on the sides of the holes to prevent rusting.

As you already have the non standard lift-a-dot fasteners on the doors then I would just drill one more hole and door mounted mirrors.

Colyn
Colyn Firth

J,
I would agree with CF re grommets and (emphatically) allowing for time to settle in.
But my understanding is that LTD fasteners on the doors was de rigeur for early cars, so would be slow automatically to add extra holes on that account alone - especially if yours is an 'early' one.
I have seen some drivers using suction-cup auxiliary mirrors of various shapes and styles on the inside of the windscreen: might help with gaining initial confidence until you get used to swivelling your head more than may be usual with more modern cars.
For what it may be worth, I was immediately more comfortable after removing the DPO's thoroughly ingenious add-ons which ultimately proved to be a distraction in London traffic. I have found that two pillar-mounted mirrors works well: but a matter for you, and at least easily reversible after the period of settling in which CF recommends and I endorse.
D
D Smith

The stick on rear view mirror is also a good option. I went this way to see over the boot mounted spare rear wheel - but now I have reverted back to the internal spare wheel am contemplating keeping the stick on (the original mirror can go on top of my GPS holder if need be)
Mike


Mike Ellsmore

This thread was discussed between 21/02/2016 and 27/02/2016

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