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MG MGA - Possible improvements & upgrades

Hi folks. For the people who ask what kinds of improvements should be made to improve reliability and driveability of their MGA's, here are my personal suggestions and thoughts. Feel free to use or disregard any of them!

. The original SU fuel pump can be troublesome, so replace it with a transistorized model. The original fuel line is made of mild steel, and rusts inside. Flakes of rust eventually reach the carburettors and cause no end of problems, so I recommend replacing the fuel lines front to back with either copper or stainless steel. Install an inline fuel filter somewhere aft of the fuel pump, preferably under the lood for easy replacement. The needle valves in the SU carbs wear and stick, causing flooding. I recommend replacing the needles and seats with Grose Jet valves instead. They use a ball bearing and spherical seat instead of conical needle and seat, and are fantastic!. Use synthetic motor oil (20 W 50) in your engine AFTER it is FULLY broken in on regular motor oil. Use of synthetic oil prevents wear, and promotes easier starts. Use of synthetic racing oil in the transmission is also highly recommended for the same reason. Redline brand tranny oil is excellent. Use synthetic grease in the front end and U joint grease fittings also. Dont forget to occasionally oil the steering rack via the "grease" fitting. (Do NOT use grease use 90 wt gear oil), and oil the rear bearing in the generator (TWO DROPS ONLY) of 30 wt motor oil! MGA electrical systems are marginal because of the generator. If you need more power you can convert to a Lucas or Bosch alternator. I would go Non Lucas! (You do know that Lucas stands for Loose Unsoldered Connections And Splices, right? ;-) I would also install quartz halogen headlights, since normal sealed beam units just dont give near enough light, particularly with a generator. Replace the thin battery cable front to back with thicker Arc welding or battery cable. It causes less electrical resistance in the starter circuit, so your starter turns faster and stays cooler. When you replace your plywood floors, you can either coat the new plywood floors with fiberglass cloth and resin, which will prevent the dreaded MGA floor rot, or you can fabricate netal floorboards from 1/8" thick (or thicker) sheet aluminum or stainless steel. When painting your car, use epoxy primer, and either 2 part enamel, or 2 part eurethane paint (It is almost too glossy) , both of which are tough and durable. Stay away from clear coat finishes which eventually chip and peel, and are hell to touch up and even worse to remove. Replace all mild steel bolts, nuts and washers with non rusting stainless steel unless originality is important. Use ANTISEIZE COMPOUND on absolutely EVERY threaded fastener you replace, especially brake fittings and bleeder screws! This will make future work on your car much easier. Use MGB V8 bushings in the front suspension A arms, or alternatively eurethane racing bushings. These last MUCH longer than the standard rubber bushings. Be sure to drain and flush your rear axle and make sure that the vent is open, otherwise you will get leakage from the axle hubs. Use MIG welding for any patches in your body panels...You get less heat warpage. Use an arc welder for frame repairs, but tack weld patches in first, then go back and weld them in. This reduces warpage. Enlarge one battery bracket and convert to a single 12 volt battery. two 6 volt batteries are lots of nuisance, and you have twice as many terminals and cables to corrode! Mix up vaseline and baking soda, and smear this all over the battery box, and the battery terminals. It will keep your battery box and battery terminals from being eaten away by battery corrosion! In the transmission, second gear syncro ring is made of brass and wears out quickly. You can replace the brass synchro ring with a steel one, but you need a specially hardened second gear to use the steel synchro ring. If you have the money to spare, this makes your tranny more durable. The transmission layshaft also wears quickly where it rides on the 3 sets of needle bearings. It is possible to eliminate the needle bearings by custom machining a bronze or brass laygear bushing. The custom made bushing can be cross drilled to allow improved lubrication of the layshaft, and just about eliminates any wear. While expensive, these tranny upgrades make the transmission last much longer. I dont mind rebuilding my transmission every 15 years or so, and have not modified mine. Use cupro nickel brake lines (from Moss) instead of steel ones. Cupro nickel brake lines are stronger and don't rust! Use nylon loop fasteners instead of metal ones to secure brake lines and wiring. They are easier on these components! Use Silicone brake fluid in your hydraulic system. It is EXTREMELY kind to rubber parts, doesnt absorb moisture like regular fluid (NO RUST), and makes your hydraulic system last MUCH longer! Ignore naysayers who say silicone brake fluid is bad! I have used Silicone for over 20 years, and have not had to replace a single hydraulic component yet!! This stuff is miracle in a bottle! Use teflon based lubricant to remove rusted nuts and bolts. This stuff will usually remove the most rusted bolts! If this stuff wont take out the rusty bolt, then heat will be required. DO NOT throw out ANYTHING you remove from your car, no matter how bad it looks. Ofen, old components can be repaired or used for patterns to make new parts. Put all removed parts into suitably sized plastic bags, and label the bags with magic marker. Many parts look similar. Labelled parts eliminate guesswork. Order your replacement parts BEFORE you need them! Anticipate which components will HAVE to be replaced. eg, bearings, bushings, seals, and brushes. Take LOTS of digital photographs when disassembling your car. You WILL forget how it goes back together over time! Work SAFELY! ALWAYS wear safety glasses, and use solid jackstands to support your raised vehicle. Keep a fire extinguisher handy! If your car has wire wheels, use silver coloured anti seize compound on the splines. This positively keeps the wire wheels from seizing to the hubs, and the silver colour blends with the colour of the spokes, when it gets flung out onto the wheel!
Glenn

Merry Christman everyone. A few related questions:

I've got about 7k on my new rebiuld and have been considering a switch to synthetic oil. This decision was slowed by an earlier discussion on leaks. I have a few fair sized leak spots under the car when it is left over night. Would I expect more leaking w/ synthetic? Is it still worth it?

Grose Jets? I am running an 18V, flowed head, Piper 270,flat top pistions w/9:1 compression, 91 octaine fuel (best we got). I have been fighting persistant pre-ignition knock when the engine is warm, heard under slight acceleration or when going u hill. I have had the timing retardeded slightly. Oh, I am also using an Aldan euro-spec distributor, I think it is model 101BR2. I installed "rich MGB" needles into stock 1500 SUs (can't remember the model). I think the needle designation was "N-5" I am presently assured I am not running lean. I apologize for my limited tunning skills. After all this, my question here is are there various Grose Jets and if so which, if any, would be suitable or preferable for this modified 1800?

I am hoping for a tuning session with a local guy recommeded by owner Dave at APT-FAST in Riverside CA. He is susposed to be a B-series guru and uses a rolling-road dyno (expensive) to address the preignition knock. I am worriewd about damagaing that engine. Ideas?
Steve Meline

Hi Steve. Synthetic oil is a bit thinner than regular motor oil, so you might leak out a little bit more. If your rear main engine seal is leaking, you can wire a shallow "catch can" underneath, to catch most of the leaked oil. Synthetic oil is far superior to regular motor oils. Synthetic oil does not thicken and turn to sludge under high heat conditions. It does not thicken or turn to Jelly at sub zero temperatures, even as low as minus 50 degrees F! Synthetic oils actually molecularly bond to engine parts, so these parts remain lubricated, even after sitting for long periods of time. Regular motor oil drains off engine parts relatively quickly, causing "dry starts", where moving parts have no lubrication at start up. Even though you have an oil leak, I think the advantages of using synthetic oil far outweigh the disadvantages, by a lage margin. Grose jets do not refer to the main metering needles, and fuel jets in the H4 carburettors. Grose jets replace the needles and seats that allow the float bowls to fill with gasoline. The advantage of grose jets is that they tend not to wear or "stick" like the standard SU needles and seats can. When the standard needles and seats stick, the carb floatbowls overfill, causing an over rich engine fuel/air mixture, which is often accompanied by raw fuel pouring out the carburettor overflow tube. Grose jets are usually very effective at preventing fuel overflow due to rust particles or junk inside the gas tank and fuel lines. Hope this helps! Merry Christmas, GLenn
Glenn

Glen

You need a J&S Safeguard Knock controller - this amazing bit of kit will advance and retard the timing in real time per cylinder, and costs around $500 (which I am sure you will spend on the dyno anyway)

just do a Google...
dominic clancy

Dominic

Have you used the J&S? I have been looking at it for some time but haven't been able to find anyone who has actually used it with an MG.

Maybe a new thread specifically on the J&S lessons learned.

Thanks

Larry

Larry Hallanger

I am about to hook up my J&S system. The car is wired for it now. I just need to plug it in. I had to make sure to get all the bugs out of the engine before I installed the unit. It will retard only the cyliner that is knocking not all four of them.
JEFF BECKER

Glenn

Interesting reading. You must be heavily iced in over there. It would have been quite a challenge even for you putting that lot in rhyme!

You mentioned "Use MGB V8 bushings in the front suspension A arms, or alternatively eurethane racing bushings. These last MUCH longer than the standard rubber bushings" I have often wondered about installing the eurethane bushes in my car, but I seem to recall someone saying that they stiffen the suspension up too much for normal driving. Any comments?

Regards

Steve
Steve Gyles

Hi Steve. I am running the V8 bushings in my MGA, and they do not cause an uncomfortable rideat all. They are much stiffer than the rubber bushings they replace,and improve handling considerably. I have not personally tried or used urethane bushings myself, so cannot comment on the difference they might make. However, I believe that at least one urethane bushing manufacturer makes many different urethane bushings of varying degrees of hardness, to accommodare racing needs, street needs, and anything in between. Try doing an internet search for urethane suspension bushings to find more info. And yes, you are correct, putting all that in poem form would indeed be tough! lol Happy Holidays Steve! Cheers! Glenn
Glenn

Guys, with all respect, you do not need a knock sensor on a properly set up MG!

This reminds me of my friend that bought some wheels that turned out to have the wrong bolt pattern for his car. Instead of returning them and admitting he'd made a mistake, he spent more than the cost of the wheels re-engineering his front hubs to take those wheels!

MGs do not inherently have a problem with knock/ping. If they do show ping, it is almost always a hot spot created by a combination of improperly finished combustion chamber and/or carbon build-up. The way to deal with these is to remove the head, make sure the chamber doesn't need any minor grinding done, and decoke the head.

In the odd case where the distributor is to blame (he has a non-stock item), recurving the distributor serves to correct things..

The last thing you need, neat as it no doubt may be, is an electronic knock sensor and timing adjustment.
Bill Spohn

I have been switching to the MGB V8 bushings every time I redo a front suspension. My TD, MGA and MGB have them. They really improve the handling, last much much longer and do not stiffen the front end.

Ira
Ira Spector

Hi, Pinking or pre ignition is often caused by poor or low octane fuel. You need to raise the octane value by putting an additive with octane booster in your fuel - I use Castrol with the standard 95 unleaded fuel in a standard 1600 engine and have no troubles - I also used it in my standard 1800 MGB GT and it too ran with no pinking. I agree , don't bother with expensive gismos . Cheers Cam
C Cunningham

Bill

If I understand what I have been reading over the past few years one of the reasons that new engines get so much better fuel efficiency is their computer control which, among other things, allows timing to remain right on the verge of pinging. Mechanical (including vacuum advance or retard) distributors are "spot on" at only one point on the speed-load curve and provide less than optimum timing under all other speed-load conditions.

What would be interesting to determine, and maybe Jeff will be able to provide some data on this, is the effect on mpg (easily monitored) and performance (requires a rolling road setup) that a device such as the J&S system will have.

Larry
58A
Larry Hallanger

Thanks for your input. This engine has pinged since almost new so it can't be coke. The head was "flowed" by an 'ol local guy who has built hundreds of B engines a few I know to be succesful racing engines (he built Jeff's but did not do his head). Who knows, maybe this head is wrong. Good 'ol Sid, I don't know how old he is but his social security number is 1.
I respect your perspective Bill and fear that your right. In the mean time though Jeff get that wiz-bang-giz-mo goin and report back to us!
Cam, here in So. Cal. the best fuel the greenies will allow to be sold is 91 octaine. Any specific recommedations from anyone on "octaine-boosters"
I also went to MGB-V8 bushings. The ride was then much firmer but plleasantly so. It lost an uncomfortable, uncertain shudder it had going over bumps. It rides much more like a new car.
A Moss, tweeked (bent), MGB underslung anti-sway bar was also a very nice upgrade to the ride. Less roll and tail-wag at the limits, more neutral.
Steve

Steve Meline

Steve, you should have no problem with 91 octane gas. If you do, you have hot spots or incorrect advance curve.

The knock sensor and timing control is a useful mechanism for controlling advance in race cars - I use on on my Twincam; it shouldn't be necessary to cure a problem you shouldn't have in the first place if the engine were operating propely.
Bill Spohn

I got rid of all the pinking when I started putting decent fuel in the car - as recommended by others on this BBS.

Whilst I now pay £0.95/litre for my 98 octane super unleaded (normal 95 unleaded over here is about £0.90/litre), the car thanks me profusely on every trip with superb performance and, as a bonus, I am told the engine should run cooler.

Steve
Steve Gyles

Any recommedations of an effective fuel additive (to be added to 91 octaine) available in the States?
Steve
Steve Meline

104+ is about the only reputable manufacturer that I'm aware of.

Jeff Schlemmer

This thread was discussed between 25/12/2005 and 01/01/2006

MG MGA index

This thread is from the archive. The Live MG MGA BBS is active now.