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MG MGB GT V8 Factory Originals Technical - Do You Hate Hood Scoops
|I was looking at some pics of converted cars and I realised that I much preferred the ones that had managed to put whatever engine was installed under the original bonnet, or perhaps under the extra space of an MGC bonnet, and that the ones with great scoops tacked on looked decidedly ....tacky.|
Now to each his own, and I am sure some people love the look of an add-on scoop - just look at the modern cars with all sorts of scoops and vents, many of which are non-functional.
Is it just me, or are such things a bit jarring when attached to MGBs?
I think you have answered your own question "to each his own"
Some scoops work and some don't
I have sent you a couple of picture of a scoop which I think works.
|That one reminds me of some GM products - a V scoop with divider. It looks better than many and I have no doubt it took a lot of work to integrate it into the bonnet.|
You are right about my own preferences - I went to a lot of trouble to avoid a scoop on my current project, using the lowest FI intake plenum I could find and dropping the engine so it cleared the bonnet.
Maybe I just saw too many chop jobs in the 70s......
Sure, to each their own... but I'm with you Bill.
IMHO, hood LOUVERS look even worse plus they let dirt and weather in and they're impossible to paint well.
On the other hand, I love a nice hammer-formed performance blister.
|Not on my car I don't.|
I used an ABS scoop blended in to give me more clearance and more airflow to force the hot air out. Looks something like the '67 GTO with divided inlet.
I think on a stock-looking car it would look out of place but I did the Sebring conversion so it fits in with the look.
Now if one were to add a scoop such as Subaru uses, that would be a bit much. Not even sure I like it on that car and it actually functions! (not like Toyota and Dodge are adding to their trucks).
|In my opinion, it starts to look to busy. I prefer to not advertise too much and can think of things I would prefer over the scoop. Just an opinion.|
|BMC Brian McCullough|
|If they are done correctly I like them! It is a personal preference thing, kind of like wheels.|
It's all about symetric's and flowing line's. IMO you dont want to put angle/flat paneled parts on a rounded car, and visa versa. But new car manufactures continue to do this all the time. They call them styling cue's. Some people like them, some don't, and thats a good thing. Otherwise we would all be driving around in the same car. Oh how boring would that be!
|Some time back I saw a B with a scoop modeled on the Ferrari style scoop used circa 1959 / 60 / 61 and I must say it looked very nice as well.|
It sat about two inches or so above the engine cover and had a very narrow chrome strip on the front edge. The width was about eight or so inches (I didn't measure it) The rest of the scoop was blended back to fit the lines of the engine cover and the paint colour was Navy Blue.
It was done partly as an additional air intake and also as an aesthetic statement.
It seems to me the debate is as much about doing it well as much as it is about to add or not to add.
Just my thoughts.
|Kit cars and hood scoops, are just want to be....something, they just do not know what.|
|I'm struggling with the same issue right now. The stacking of me 4 bbl over the edelbrock intake, and then an air filter is just too high. I really don't want a scoop. I was thinking of a long bubble, something like what you see on an XKE or old vette that is big enough to take in the air filter, and end as an open cowel. I could do it in fiberglass, but then, theres the issue of what happens when the hood is opened and it flexes? Not a pretty picture, and a lot of work. Still a lot of soul serching to do on this topic.|
|I like them if they are functional; they are, on both my 05 Subaru WRX STi and my 78 MGB V8.|
|Michael S. Domanowski|
I think that is why I like the MGC bonnet so much. You have the bubble at the front and the one above the carbs. For the MGB V6/V8 conversion that carb bubble, although the appearance is great is strange knowing that when you open it up, it has no use. I would like to get my hands on a MGC replica bonnet, but the standard will have to do for now.
BTW: I have seen a few scoops on MGB's that are respectable, but I never want one on my own car.
|BMC Brian McCullough|
|Bill, I agree I don't really care for most scoops on MGs. I've seen a few that are nice and some that were hideous. Sometimes they are necessary, but most of the time with a little planning such as you've done on the Jamacian you can get the power train low enough to clear. I guess that doesn't leave much excuse for the huge bulge in the hood of my V6 midget, but I really wanted the fuel injection and couldn't figure out any other solution on that car. My MGA hood will be smooth as a baby's butt and still get the 4.0 I6 underneath.|
|Please put me in the 'hate hood scoop' camp. I don't even like the hood on the C.|
|Nah, much better to just let the enderle blower scoop stick through a HOLE in the hood.|
|High five Jim! I was just thinking that the polished engine bits sticking through a hole would be far more attractive than the scoop. It makes more of a statement too. "Yes I need the hole!"|
|Can't see why you would want one - if you can not keep the lump under the normal bonnet - you have a choice of bulge (MGC, Costello or RV8) or Jim's solution - if heat is the issue you might need a louvre (MGA Aston Martin Etc) but unless you are keen to show off (rather than demonstrate the power of the V8) an inner wing extractor vent can be quite effective.|
After all it's an MG not an Italian Screamer !
|I think if the rest of the car's body is modified with flares and wide tires, the scoop can add another appealing dimension to the car. |
As for the MGC hood... I admire it for it's historical value on an MGC, but in reality I think it looks like an afterthought on the design team's part, which I'm sure is what it was. Especially the little bump for the carburetor clearance... come on! Would anybody here, if faced with the challenge of fitting a straight six engine into an MGB, have created a hood that looked like the MGC's? But then they did have a budget to meet I suppose...
|very interesting. I have both a GT with a scoop and without. It APPEARS to me that everyone here is more for looks than performance, with the exception of Jim and Jeff.|
Hood scoops shuld be functional, holes with a purpose and looks for shows.
Some times there is no choice as Bill's Midget, sometimes we whant that fresh air at low speeps and fresh air a high speeds for performance. The Cobra is a good example it a small scoop and earlier models did not. The 2002 Firebird is quicker than the 2002 Camaro, same engine same body, difference big SCOOPS for air. I guess is a choice between performance and looks.
But yeas, I agree with Bill you can plan and have both, my RD has a cool air box no scoop, the intension was to showw tha you can pout a air box under the hood of an MGB. But....a scoop that is well design is much better than a cool air box and big hole with a blower sticking out is good and better if it had a big scoop from the rear of the hood all the way to the front, similar to those in Formula 1 or Pro stock cars.
The choice is yours.
Bill said: "big scoop from the rear of the hood all the way to the front, SIMILAR TO THOSE IN FORMULA 1..." (emphasis added).
huh? (This bulletin board really needs photos!)
In deciding how fresh air should come to the engine, there's a balance to be struck... and not just between style and power-production. Some hood scoops are real leaf and water catchers. Some add significant aerodynamic drag or obstruct the driver's view. Most add significant cost (or effort).
In the particular case of MGB, there's a really neat and easy alternative to scooping air... turn the cowl vent into a cowl-induction system! (It's aerodynamic, and it already has a grille and water-seperation system that work. Besides, who needs a heater anyway!?!)
I want to endorse something Peter said: "It seems to me the debate is as much about doing it well as much as it is about to add or not to add." Amen to that! IMHO, the MGC bulge may look like an "afterthought" - but it looks like a fairly well executed afterthought.
|I sorta like the hole in the hood method with a scoop sitting on top of a 671 blower.|
Sorta like this....:P
|I originally went with the stock unaltered hood for stealth mode, but I have always like cowl induction hoods and protruding scoops & injector stacks. Hotrod stuff.|
Lately, I feel the need for the engine to flex its muscles and dent the hood (bonnet) with a bulge similar to the RV8. I really like the subtle bump that is used on the Miata. A cross between that & the RV8 would look great on an MGB, IMO.
|One of our local members built a Ford V8 B and used the small bulge from the hood of a Mitsubisi Eclipse. The body work was superb and it looked great. Some of you may have seen the car, it's since been sold. Bright yellow B roadster with no bumpers.|
|Bill you forgot me!|
Here are some photos of my scoop:
|Michael S. Domanowski|
|I dislike things added to cars to make them look fast when those changes donít help and thus actually hamper the carís capabilities. Things like view obstructing scoops for no functional reason or spoilers or wings. Adding a wing that is not needed just adds weight and air resistance, as does a large scoop.|
Once, from a distance I saw a nice looking bulge in the hood of an MGB in a wrecking yard. When I got closer I saw it was actually the hood from a Nissan 280Z just setting there to protect the engine compartment from the weather. Itís funny that I couldnít tell that from a distance, but anyway I thought a bulge of that style might look good.
I recall reading the engineers at MG could have set the motor in the MGC back far enough to avoid the bulges and improve weight distribution, but only if they limited it to manual transmissions. The larger automatic transmission wouldnít fit in that position so they all went forward. Imagine how the press would have reacted to an MGC with a better weight distribution. The big bulge is from the high position of the radiator. I wonder if it could have been set rearward far enough to avoid that. The high positioned radiator wasnít necessary by the time of the MGBGT V8 because they figured out how to use electric fans to allow the center of the radiator to be mounted below the water pump and they figured out to fill the radiator remotely.
I wonder if anyone is crazy enough to try shifting the motor back in a manual shifting MGC to see if the MGB hood would fit.
|some scoops i like some i dont,,the meanie has an mgc hood on it & i like the little bulge,although it serves no purpose. the larger bulge is ok to, but i dont care for the chrome strip on it, when i repaint in a few years i may do away with that.. the p.o. drilled round holes in the front of the big bulge & although i've only been to a couple of local L.B.C. meets i've gotten alot of crap about those holes,,but i swear i didnt do it!!theres some s/steel meshing behind the holes & i kinda like..i'm wondering if a vent [flip up] thing of some nature at the rear of the hood would elievate some of the heat in the foot wells?? anybody done this?? to a c hood? the p.o. gave me a B hood with 2 rectangular louvers in it,I DONT LIKE!!! its tahiti blue & dam cheap if anyone's interested...|
|Would using the cowl be a way to remove heat. Denny|
|CW, that's a Hilborn scoop. Very popular with the carbed blower crowd. Here's a shot of an Enderlie, more common on injected blowers:|
I also think things like air dams, other aerodynamic devices such as wings, modified bodywork etc should be functional.
Here you can see that the widened front bodywork is almost imperceptible to the casual glance yet it allows the use of 8" wide rubber. The rear is more dramatic in appearance but with the track widened nearly 6" front and rear it is a real challenge to be subtle. The wing in the rear is an example of active aerodynamics. Linked to the axle, it controls rear end float by varying the angle of attack based on height of the bodywork above the roadway. But of course without an effective front dam it would be useless.
There really is no practical way to put a scoop on this car without making it very very ugly. And I know, some of you already think it is but you're entitled to your opinions. Doesn't make you right but you have a right. I did conclude, after building it that it would be possible to build the engine short enough to fit under a stock hood, but even if it occurred to me before starting I would not have done it that way just because the hood treatment is the perfect compliment to the rest of the car. If I were building the ultimate sleeper then yes, I would do it that way. This ain't it. I'm actually extremely satisfied with the way the car has turned out. Still a bit more to do, I'm finishing up a total rewire, need new upholstery next and carpet, and there's the IRS to finish and install eventually. Maybe even one of Ted's IFS's in its future. But at this point exerything but the wiring is window dressing. This summer's all about wheel time.
Oh, and you'd be surprised at just how good the visibility over and around the scoop is. It really doesn't impact the sight lines while driving at all, that is, unless you like to watch your own front bumper.
|i like most smaller cowls but on top of the c hood?? i dont know? it should work fine heat rises, holes in front of hood blast most of the hot stuff out on the windshield, i really think theres no where for it to go now so it bakes your feet,theres no heat insulation under any of the carpet that would help to,but p.o. glued it everywhere & im not rippin all that up till i do repaint & some sort of custom interior,that is if i keep the car, awhile back i went to look at a delapidated old td [no engine,tranny] old guy wouldnt sell it but got me wantin one,then theres the 67/68 convert. firebird thing, could win the lottery & get a lotus, ever seen a C hood with a cowl?|
|I like no hood at all.|
|When upgrading my 4.6 GT I had clearance problems so made this scoop. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j30/V8bloke/bulge.jpg It is vented to the rear. I tried to keep it as small and low as possible. I cant say its particularly attractive but very functional. Would look better same colour as car.|
|And a shot from the rear. http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j30/V8bloke/bulgerear.jpg|
Running for cover
|I've seen lots worse. Heck, I've owned and driven lots worse! I think you have a good looking ride Mark.|
|The big problem with hood scoops is that so many people think that having an opening in the front of the hood will force air into the carb, producing a ram-air effect. The truth is, you can get more air into the engine compartment from the vacuum produced at the base of the windshield. That's where the heater vent is located, and as Curtis commented, it could be modified very easily to perform well. |
Most V8 conversions can be kept under the hood profile with a little extra time (and money) spent engineering and machining things. I guess I'm the type that would rather drive a "sleeper."
|Tell you what Jeff, if you ever decide you want a blower on a 215 or Rover just let me know and I'll tell you how to keep it under the hood. It'd make for a darned impressive sleeper, especially when you go to show off your handiwork.|
|Jim what's the trick? Paxton supercharger in place of the alternator force feeding the carb through a low-profile snorkel? I'm getting sweaty just thinking about it!!!|
|The reverse hood scoop on my 4.3L V6 accomplishes three things...1) provides hood clearance for the air cleaner 2) provides air induction at road speed 3) provides engine compartment hot air evacuation at idle and slow traffic conditions...|
|Hey Mark I think your hood is great. Mike yours looks good as well.|
Everyone has a threshold/expectation for what they like, what turns me off is a scoop pop riveted in place.
You flip the M-90 Eaton over and fabricate a single plane intake to suspend it from, just barely above the lifter pan. Since the Eaton is fed from the rear you then can wrap an inlet tube up and over the intake manifold, or off to the side if you prefer. An EDIS ignition gets the distributor out of the way for the drive, and the whole package then fits under the hood. Injectors are a good addition (can be positioned shooting straight down), and there should be just enough room above the intake manifold for an Enderlie style scoop/throttle body.
|hello, mike your cowl looks great but a liitle to high /wide for my tastes the little non functioning bubble is gone i kinda like mine but have serious reservations how that would look with a cowl?? mark[uk] i'd like to see a better picture of your hood in particular the small bubble perhaps a photo taken from the passenger side at an angle out front from the headlight, its about all the higher/wider i'd be willin to go although i'd love to see one 3 or 4" longer. thank you|
This thread was discussed between 16/04/2006 and 23/04/2006
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