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MG MGB Technical - Banjo Axle Hub Nut Socket
|We are having issues with hub nuts on the race cars coming loose.|
This is because we cannot get them tight enough. Should be 180 ft lb.
The tin socket offered by Moss and others is not a good fit, and being so long tends to slip off the nut.
So I have arranged for a batch of sockets to be made, to my design, so we can get this nut tightend to the correct torque.
They will be an impact socket, which is a bit over the top, in black and 3/4in drive.
Price is going to have to be £60, no VAT. They will be ready for Stoneleigh in February.
I would appreciate some comments on this, and if there is a really good demand, I can get the price down.
|I would be interested in one, although I'm not sure I can justify spending Â£60.|
Let's hope you can get enough orders to get the price a bit lower.
|Dave O'Neill 2|
|If you get your local engineering shop to take a 1-2mm off the end of the moss type socket they give a much snugger fit which stops them slipping....worth a try!|
Have you got a stall at Stoneleigh? If do you know where abouts?
Do you use the tab washers on your racing cars? They don't weigh very much!
|I tighten and loosen Salisbury hub nuts (150 ft lb) on my wire wheel axle using a long extension to get inside the hub, with the outer end near the breaker bar resting on a piece of wood of an appropriate length resting on the ground. With the breaker bar horizontal, all the forces trying to make the socket slip off the nut are going down through the piece of wood, leaving purely a rotational force at the socket and nut. With the wheel on the hub and the tyre resting on the ground to some extent (spinner off of course), it never fails. The same is done with Rostyle wheels with the centre pushed out.|
|I've had good luck just taking a commercially available socket (heavy duty mechanic stuff) and grinding off the entry bevel on a head planing machine.|
|Bill, interesting! Find me a commercially available socket for an 8 sided nut and I will buy one!! This side of the pond most our our nuts are 6 sided, but the axle hub nut is 8 sided.|
Paul, yes take your point, but that is a proper nut that you can get some purchase on. The banjo nut is only about 1/4in thick.
David, yes of course we use the tab washers, but the nuts can still come loose. No I will not have a stand, just a mobile phone and a rucksack full of sockets!!!
Ollie, yes you are correct, but it is still a piss fit, and slips off if you get it any where near 180ft lbs. Oh and by the way, I am a local engineering shop!
Appreciate all the comments.
Keep them coming.
At this stage I dont think I am going to commit to large quantities as not many people seem to appreciate the need for a proper socket. They obviously dont torque the nut up!
When I raced a midget, I invested in a socket for the rear hub nut, but as it was hexagonal, it was readily available...although it was still 3/4" drive. It did get a lot of use though - Midgets only having a single row bearing, rather than the double bearing of the MGB and, presumably, the MGA.
Some Midget racers dispense with the tab washer and used Loctite - me included - and didn't suffer any loose nuts! The theory being that the tab washer is relatively soft and could deform with the extreme cornering forces, allowing the nut to work loose.
I had read of someone fabricating a socket by welding some strips of steel to the end of an old halfshaft (inside) and then welding a large nut to the outside. I had contemplated doing the same but don't have a spare halfshaft. Do you have any broken ones?
|Dave O'Neill 2|
|Col, see my thread on the MGA site re British Tools.|
|Gary thanks and I have found his MG tool as well. It looks little better than the Moss one, just fabricated from tube and too long.|
At $45 US I think no contest.
I will proceed with my engineered solution. As soon as I have the sample I will post pics.
It is machined from solid, and altogether a different piece of kit.
|Dave, sorry no broken shafts, we have thrown them!!|
Sod this fabrication lark - just buy the proper tool from me!!
|Tools to fit Imperial nuts are hard to find here in Berlin (though Harley riders have helped enormously). Improvisation is essential.|
I filed a socket from 1/2" plate and welded a piece of steering column to it. It is a nice fit. To keep it on the nut, I added a cross piece which bolts to two of the wheel studs. Torque is calculated by my weight multiplied by the length of the steering column.
I'll see if I can dig it out and make a photo. I'm afraid it's not a tool I use every day! I won't be getting into competition with you Colin, it took ages to make and I've run out of old steering columns.
|"The banjo nut is only about 1/4in thick."|
The original problem being complained about was slipping off the nut because the tool was so long.
|Here's my rather Heath Robinson tool for tightening the nut on the banjo axle hub. |
Fortunately I had a nut off (it was only finger tight, good grief!) so I only needed to file away at the pre-drilled hole until it fitted exactly. The most important thing with the job was getting the thing marked out exactly in the first place.
The bar with the two holes passes between the head and the shaft and is retained by the wheel nuts. This gets round the problem of a big tool and delicate hard to reach nuts.
|Colin, there are 8 sided sockets available for HD mechanics - some American vehicles also use these sorts of nuts on their hubs.|
It's been 30 years since I picked one up but I checked and saw a similar one on Barney's site - http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/tools/hub_socket.htm
Look most of the way down at the black socket. That one drives on the flats with drive keys instead of octagonal faces, but should do the trick. Like the price, too - Sears sells them in Canada for $27
|I have the sockets available now. Picture below.|
They are 3/4in drive and actually impact sockets.
I will be at Stoneleigh Sun 20th Feb, and will have some with me.
Phone is 07831 387250.
Price is still going to have to be £60 for this first batch.
|Nicely done. RAY|
|Friday, I still have a few of the sockets left. Stoneleigh on Sunday Mobile 07831 387250.|
I am interested in buying one. I sent you an email with my information.
|Thanks to everyone who I met at Stoneleigh.|
I now have only 2 of the sockets left.
This thread was discussed between 19/01/2011 and 07/03/2011
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