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MG MGB Technical - ethanol conversion

I am looking for information on converting my 67 MGB to run on E85 ethanol. Anyone out there have any experience on a similar conversion?
adrian

I would suggest Google if nothing shows up here soon.

Largely, ethanol still deteriorates rubber connections. The 10% or so ADM has convinced our legislators we need in our everday gas does not rise to the the threshold of harm. But 85% does. (And Methanol, of course, eats through rubber even quicker.) So all those hoses would need replacing.

Also it does not have the energy rating of gasoline, so your carbs will need to run richer.

I do wonder why you would want to make that change, unless you have access directly to a still. Studies show that ethanol as a fuel uses more energy up in production and distribution than gained in its production. It only costs less to us as consumers because we as tax payers are paying for the subsidies to make it.

Anyway - good luck. It can be done, and may make an interesting project, but if many people did made the conversion, it would only hurt our energy problems further.

PS - If you can read Portugese, the Brazilians have committed to ethanol production in a big way as a fuel - but they have a different cost structure than we do, though I'm not sure if they're not chasing their tail, too.

(Now, I confess I run on a blend of ethanol, water and caffiene enhanced fluids myself, so I appreciate the value of the molecular structure.)
John Z

I just saw a show on TLC about Brazil and their ethanol cars.

The new cars run on both gas and ethanol or a mixture of it. There is a computer that measures the mixture in the gas tank and it adjustes the engine accordingly.

The show discussed how they got about the same (a difference of 5 hp on a 100 hp engine) horsepower using the different fuels. Additionally mpg differences were also very small.

They make their ethanol out of sugarcane vs. corn in the US. I wonder if that has an impact on the overall cost? More ethanol from the same acre for sugarcanevs corn in the US? They did discuss how the process for converting the the sugarcane was simpler than converting corn.

While watching the show they showed several gas stations and the price for the ethanol was less than 1/2 what they pay for gas, so either it is heavly subdised or they have found a way to produce ethanol using less engergy and cost.
Cris DeYoung

Ethanol was another giant hoax perpertrated by large corporations and the greedy politicians who act as their puppets in Congress on the public. As you said, ADM, one of the most corrupt companies around, was the prime motivator for that. ADM has been caught many times in 'price fixing' schemes and the chairman's relative (grandson?) is/was in prison for that. With ADM if it ain't one thing it's another.
Mike MaGee

Brazil has more sugar cane than they know what to do with. The ethanol is sold at below world market prices to protect the sugar cane industry. In effect it is subsidised by the government. The reason ADM and other companies have engaged in price fixing is because the price structure of commodities is disastrous if there is a slight surplus because the commodity must be sold and will be sold at any price. With a surplus that price may be far below cost. I am not justifying breaking the law. The motivation to price fix in commodities is great because of these econ dynamics.

Huge investments for a crap shoot on the price, makes a huge incentive to cover your tail.

Barry
Barry Parkinson

It seems to me that growing your own (corn, sugar cane or whatever) would be a lot better than importing it from an area so unsettled.

I like the idea. What is your source??? Is it easy to get and priced right??

Also, if there is a government subsidy - so what? It seems to me that if you want to do it - there is no problem
Frank Baker

Something else to note: ATF frowns on an individual posessing too much ethanol unless it's "denatured" with another substance.
Bill Boorse

E-85 ethanol was sold at the pumps last time I was in Minnessota. Seems everyone had a story about getting a tankfull by mistake; no big deal if the car was fuel injected. Cheaper, but I could not tell if it was a better deal due to less energy per gallon and the fact that it is subsidized. As far as subsidizing goes, whats the big deal: we subsidize Bush's home country of Saudi Arabia to the tune of a few trillion a year, why not just keep the $$$$$ here?

Pete
Pete

I looked into converting an MG when I started running my truck on E85. You'd need a stainless steel fuel tank, new fuel lines throughout, a fuel pump suitable for E85 and fuel injection.

While it would be possible to convert a carb to run on E85 the metals our carbs are made from wouldn't withstand the corrosiveness of E85 for long. You really do need fuel injection with all the accompanying sensors in the tank etc with the UCU to control it all.

In the long run it would be easier to pull an E85 engine and all necessary ancilliaries out of a modern car and fit it to your MG. This is something I am vaguely considering for a V6 conversion I will be doing as soon as my smokey 4 cylinder finally dies.
The Wiz

They sell alot of ethanol mixed gas in Nebraska. Of course they make the stuff.
CW Strong

Yes, Nebraska has a lot of corn and ethanol plants dotting the countryside. When the wind is right, it kind of smells like baking bread. There is at least one station in my town that sells E85, and there are flex fuel vehicles available (somewhere) to burn it. There was an article in the paper today that at $2.85/gal for unleaded vs. $2.75 for gasohol (not E85) there's a bit of a savings. You get approximately 1.6 percent less mileage with the gasohol. This is all from (weak) memory, so correct me if I'm way off.

You'd need a substantially bigger fuel tank with E85 to cover the same distance as unleaded. I try not to use any alcohol except for medicinal purposes, hehe. I don't know why they waste their time making fuel for cars, white lightnin' should bring more bucks. In Mexico, you can buy a liter of cane alcohol (for drinking, if you don't mind the bite) for like 3 bucks.
Tom

We've not noticed a difference in mileage or power when running E85 in the Wiz's truck. The exhaust definitely smells different. And his truck is fuel injected.

Here's a list of Flex-Fuel vehicles. There are quite a few:

http://www.e85fuel.com/e85101/flexfuelvehicles.php

My car missed by a year. BTW, around here E85 is about 50-60¢ per gallon cheaper.

Bill Boorse is right, and that's why they add 15% gasoline to the ethanol. Mainly to keep people from drinking it.
TheMiz

This thread was discussed between 15/09/2005 and 17/09/2005

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