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MG MGB Technical - Old style filter element problem

I went through my first oil change in my new 1970 MGB and have run into a problem changing the old style filter element. I followed all instructions from the Haynes manual for the Intermediate type filter pictured on page 26 of the Haynes manual. The problem I’m having is with seemingly missing bits and pieces.

I’ve included a link to a picture posted to Yahoo pictures. The new filter with two large seals are on the left. The used paper cylinder is on the right.

<http://photos.yahoo.com/sdyck99>

The parts reference below are as pictured in the Haynes manual. I’m missing part #8 which is a seal and part #11 a clip. The plate that sits on top of the filter element also seems slightly different, with out the indent for the seal (#8) to sit in.

The filter element that was in there when I took it apart was a paper element but sealed in its own little tube. It didn’t have the bottom rubber seal #3 but wasn’t leaking any oil.

Ok here’s my question, I’ve purchased a felt element , but can I use it without the missing clips and Seal? Is the element that was in there better than the felt one I bought?

Any suggestions would be great!


Thanks,

Steve D
Steve D

Steve, I could not get the link to work.
Problem somewhere?
Pete, Australia.
Peter Thomas

Steve. Is this a show car or do you like to hurt? If it is a show car, the felt element was the original type used while the paper element was the common replacement in the US. We used to buy the paper elements from J.C. Whitney because they cost about half of what the Brit felt elements cost. But, if you car is not a show car, the oil filter adapter for the 18V engine will fit right up to your engine and make your life much easier. You should be able to pick up a used adapter for a lot less than the new cost from Moss, et al. You might also be able to pick up any missing parts from someone who has done the conversion. As I remember it, the clip was to hold the parts--spring, washer and seal, onto the long bolt for easier assembly. I do not remember the seal they show, but it has been many years since I used that system. Why not bolt it back together and turn the engine over until you get oil pressure (without starting it), then inspect for leaks. It would seem that, if it has been working without these parts, it should function without them now with no ill effects. But, the 18V adapter is really the way to go on anything except a show car. Les
Les Bengtson

Steve,
Two things:
1. I have somewhere a system file of the oil filter housing components. I'll dig that out and have a look. Its a while since I last did mine and I don't remember all the components, though your top plate seems different from memory. Not that that in itself has to mean anything sinister,
2. I have purchased Ryco brand replacements for the style of filter you have taken out of your car. The first I replaced looked exactly like the one you found. I believe the one in my car came from the local MG rep (Rover now). Ryco brand are common here and I have used them in the family cars for years with excellent results. For the B they come without the paper cover you (and I) have found on our used versions, but otherwise are essentially identical. I don't know if Ryco are available in Canada but surely it is likely that some company covers this market there if it is covered here (similar populations?).

Like you I prefer to keep the original set-up, though that depends on being able to buy filter replacements.
I'll get back to you.
Regards
Roger
Roger

Thanks for the help, I may consider conversion to a spin on filter if I can find a used part from an 18V engine.

To crank the oil pressure up without starting do you just disconnect the wire from the coil to the distributor?

Steve D
Steve D

Steve. That will work and so will removing the coil lead and grounding it. As long as no spark gets to the distributor cap, the way you accomplish it is not too important. Removing the spark plugs will allow the engine to spin faster and drain the battery less than leaving them in. Les
Les Bengtson

Steve: You can usually get oil pressure up by cranking with no choke - it usually won't start if it hasn't been running for a while. The electrical gauge takes a little longer to register than the mechanical, so that that into account too.
I converted my 69 with a used spin on filter head that I got from Tony Barnhill at the Autoist. Quite reasonable. Cleaned up like new. The same bolt, o-ring, and copper washer (get a new O-ring and washer) are used as the old housing. Dig the old O-ring out with a pick or a knife. I used a mirror and with a utility knife (aka the dread box cutter) I was able to cut into the old O-ring enough to lift a piece of it out and then slowly peel the rest out, working from from above. It can be a bugger.
Andrew Blackley

Steve,
As others have said, unless you have strong originality concerns, you don't want the canister-style filter. They lacked an anti-drainback valve and thus allowed the engine to run sans lube after starting cold. Spring for the 18V filter adapter and spin-on filter. Remember to get the adapter-to-block and bolt-to-adapter seals....
Rob Edwards

Steve,
I have found the file I mentioned but it is too small a representation to make sense of on screen. I have an alternative - from Porter's 'Total Guide to MGB Maintanance'. It is two pages (with the unique filter you have purchased included) which I am happy to scan and send. I'll do that later today (Sunday) as its 1.50 am here at present.

The components you showed in your photograph seem pretty right and on reflection match what I found in my 69 MK11, which I know to be very original. Mine too is missing the rubber washer but it doesn't seem to matter. I have no leaks. Porter also explains the second gasket ring (its on earlier cars with the downward pointing oil canister).
Regards
Roger
Roger

Steve,
I have sent two emails with attachments. Hope they help.
Regards
Roger
Roger

This may seem obvious,but..keep the old pieces/parts if you do the conversion. The next owner may be interested in them. If not, maybe someone online would be.
kids1

Thanks again everyone, very helpful.

Roger thanks in advance for the pictures and info, I won't get to see the pics until I get to work tomorrow.

I decided today to swap the filter and see if it would leak. I went digging for the old O-ring and couldn't find anything, so I put in the new O-ring. I don't know why it did't leak before.

Took out the plugs, disconnected the coil, and cranked the engine. No leaks but no oil pressure registering either. Is that because the plugs are out? Its amazing that the more I learn the more I realize I don't know.

Steve D
Steve D

Dumb question - even for me.

I realized after I posted the above that the question about the plugs was dumb, even for me.

I haven't done anything that should effect the oil pressure. I am guessing that with this new filter it may take a fair amount of canking to move the oil into the filter and throught the system before presure will build. I have noticed that on normal start-up it takes a few seconds for pressure to build. With only the starter turning the crank it may take quite a while longer?

Fair guess this time?

Thanks
Steve D

Steve,
"Fair guess this time?"
I think so. Mine always takes those few seconds to build oil pressure. I guess, too, you will need to establish that there are no leaks under normal driving conditions ie motor running.
Regards
Roger
Roger

Everything works :)

Thankyou for all your help!
Steve D

This thread was discussed between 21/05/2002 and 28/05/2002

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