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MG MGB Technical - Steering Column

My 73 MGB has some vertical play in the steering column of about a 1/2" up/down. Is this something I should look into or is it normal on this 73?
Thanks,
Ted
T. Molaski

Ted,

I had a similar problem with my 76 BGT. There is a spacer / washer at the top of teh steering column. Mine was very worn and I replaced it (I think it was nylon) and it improved it greatly.


Garreth
Garreth

Ted; I believe USA cars and UK cars used different steering columns. USA cars have a ball bearing in a sleeve in the upper end of the column. They do tend to get loose. I peened the sleeve around the bearing with a hammer to tighten mine. You will have to remove the steering wheel and the top bearing to try correcting the problem. Removing 1/2" of movement may not be possible, I wonder if the roller balls in your bearing may have fallen out? I have some photos of a disassembled steering column in Yahoo that shows the relationship of the steering column parts in 68-74 USA columns.
http://f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/flash1929/album?.dir=/MGB+Steering+Column+upper+bearings&.src=ph&store=&prodid=&.done=http%3a//f1.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/flash1929/my_photos
Good luck, Clifton
Clifton Gordon

Hey does anyone know how to remove a steering wheel when it seems to be frozen in place? I can turn the wheel fine and all that for driving, but I want to change the dingy old steering wheel out and I can't get the damned thing to budge. I've used the correct wheel puller for the job but its be in for so long thats it practically stuck. Any ideas that doesn't resort to me having to blow torch it out would be very, very helpful!!
CJD Dark

All the manuals say "gently tap the boss with ahammer whilst pulling the wheel towards yourself". Mine was similarly stuck and so picked up a three leg puller, fitted it and started to tighten everything, at full grip and a few extra turns there was an unsticking and everything went slack with the wheel in my lap!

I found that I wasn't doing it right before a friend showed me how to use the pullers.
dacross

Don't sit in the driver seat with a hammer trying to bash the steering wheel off from behind.

Not unless you want to eat steering wheel and lose your teeth.

Best remove the whole steering column if you are having trouble.


Garreth
Garreth

RE: "gently tap the boss with a hammer whilst pulling the wheel towards yourself". I think the archives are pretty stuffed with this tip, but as a chance to practice typing:

The accepted method is to unscrew the nut part way, leaving it flush with the end of the threads on the steering column. Thus, you can tap it with a hammer without ruining the threads.

With two hands, pull out on the steering wheel. While applying this pressure, with your third hand tap your hammer on the nut - bonking the shaft back into the column, opposite to the pressure on the steering wheel. The wheel should come loose all at once. Which the other good reason to leave the nut on the shaft. Keeps you from an emergency trip to the dentist.

Matt Kulka

Gerry Masterman on the MGBExperience BBS has developed a nylon replacement for the bearings that appears to work well and may be producing them in the future. Do search over there and contact him if you want to fix it.
J.T. Bamford

You can contact Gerry Masterman at gmasterman@aol.com

For photos check out http://www.mgbexperience.com/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=132296&t=132296
Jim Lema

Nope I fully disagree. (as usual)

The Collapseable USA columns cannot be
properly repaired by "hammering" anything...

Reguards to the old pro's about it.

I've been involved with the development of
a replacement bush for both upper and lower
column bearing failures.

If one would remove the upper bearing from
the carrier (cut off the rolled lip that
traps the ball bearing) you would see the
generally severe damage done to the bearing
carrier where the bearing race rides. The
splines get worn down to the point of rattle
and in my case beyond. So the reality is the
bearing is FINE the race in the carrier is
huffed and allows this movement.

Sorry again, this is no hammer fix.

GEM enterprises has a replacement bush
to fix the steering. It works and is
a job done in a few hours. Installed
the upper one on my '73 B (while the
column is still in the car) and she's
WONDERFUL! No steering play full turn
lock to lock and very smooth.

a related post:
http://www.mgbexperience.com/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=137752&t=137752

As far as the wheel goes - I love you guys!
Can't understand WHY you all make such work
for yourselves... harmonic balance puller
and about 3 minutes....

CYA! <thats cheers in American>

HowY

Thanks for all the replies, they have been helpful.
Ted
Ted M.

HowY, I got the idea to peen the bearing from reading a tech note written by non other than John Twist. Until recently there was little alternative other than some expensive machine work or try to find a good used column. I agree peening isn't the best solution but it did work for me.

I agree removing the steering wheel on 70 to 76 cars is easy with a harmonic balancer puller. On the 68-69 there are no threaded holes in the wheel to attach the puller bolts.

FWIW, Clifton
Clifton Gordon

and nothing works... The wheels still on the car right now, and after trying all of your wonderful suggestions guys, its still stuck tight. It turns wonderfully and all that J.T. and there's no reason to replace a perfectly good bushing. But I still can't break the damned steering wheel loose on the car. It's stuck in there tight. I tried the harmonic balancer puller already, the prong bent on it. I used another with a impact driver I've got... which now needs to be replaced. I have never come across a steering wheel this determined to stay put. And if your wondering why I'm needing to replace the wheel, its because of the black rubber surround on it's come completely loose and makes it dangerous to trust driving wit it.
CJD Dark

CJ. Since you intend to replace the steering wheel anyway, follow Garreth's advice and remove the steering column. Not a difficult task. Then, have the column pressed of the steering wheel with a hydraulic press. While I have not had this problem myself, I assisted a couple of professional mechanics in doing this with a badly stuck steering wheel. Les
Les Bengtson

Guys, I've never found that beating on anything was the answer. Use a puller, just as HowY suggest and the wheel will come easily. With the right puller availiable from nearly any auto parts place, you simply remove the nut and two of the bolts that hold the steering wheel to the hub. Replace these two bolts with the proper bolts from the puller kit,install the puller and put a 8" cresent wrench to work. The wheel will come off without the risk of damaging the shaft, the wheel or the threads on the shaft. Not trying to put John Twist down here but just because some big name says to do something does not make it the right or best way. The BFH will only offer you more problems to fix in the future.
gerry masterman

I had a stuck steering wheel on my 77 roadster, the silly 4 spoke rubber encapsulated one. No amount of bashing and pulling would shift it and I couldn't apply heat for fear of setting fire to the wheel. I tried drilling holes through the wheel and rigging up a puller using thick steel bars and 10mm bolts but it still wouldn't budge. Since I had damaged the wheel I resorted to sawing it off with a hacksaw untill I had removed all but the inner part containing the splines. A decent two legged puller was then employed with a long extension on the handle. Just as I thought it was about to break, the wheel came off (what was left of it) and no visible sign of what was causing it to stick. If you wheel is stuck as much as mine, you may have to resort to the same medicine. The trick is to get the puller legs as close to the centre of the hub as possible. Good luck.
roger lawson

Some have found that using a puller just distorts the wheel. Others say that all you need to do is rock the wheel violently from side to side (with a loose nut) and it will come free. Personally I have removed wheels from both solid and collapsible columns - without causing damage to anything - by slackening the nut, bracing my knees behind the wheel, placing one hammer on the end of the shaft and hitting that with another hammer. Saves you having to wait while that third hand grows.
Paul Hunt

So who & where are these GEM Enterprise guys?

A web search turned up a computer parts supplier.
Daniel Wong

Gerry Masterman is GEM Enterprise. Don't know anything about him other than reading his posts on the MGExperience BBS. Seems to know MGB's and their problems. Try posting there.
Jim Lema

Daniel Wong
Ran across this link. http://www.shadetreemg.com/gem.htm
Jim Lema

Well, here I am! How can I be of service?
gerry masterman

While we're here - has anyone changed the rack
tube bushings?

I figuired that if anyone would go through the
trouble of taking apart the steering column
- you'd might as well do everything else, too.
Daniel Wong

I changed the passenger side bush on a Mini once - never again, I'd rather fit a recon rack.

'Might as well', where would you stop!? ;o)
Paul Hunt

No one seems to mention the issue of the early "collapsible" steering column. I have not stripped it down but I understand that there is a "D" shaped plastic component within the tube that wears and gives rise to play (rotation) in my case 1/2" on rim of steering wheel.

I am told that no spares exist and a fix involves drillin through shaft and pinning with a plastic knitting needle(as opposed to a roll pin)

Is this that it the solution??
melvyn simonson

I'm trying to remove my steering wheel ('78 MGB) without much luck. I've tried everything including some of the hints on this site. What type of puller would be best and where are they available? Any words of wisdom would be appreciated.

Corey Gold

A regular steering wheel puller that has bolts that screw into the hub. Use by removing two of the bolts holding the wheel to the hub and replace them with the bolts in the kit.
gerry masterman

Here's one for example http://www.autobarn.net/cta1512l.html?AID=10274001&PID=613288
gerry masterman

Melvyn, if the telescoping feature is not needed, just have the two pieces welded together solid. The cross-section on mine is more of a circle with two flats on opposite sides. The plastic seems to have been injection moulded between the two halves and allowed to leak out through four 1/16" or so holes.
gerry masterman

Thanks Gerry, as I said I have never seen this item. The idea of welding is a last resort so the plastic pins are a sort of halfway house. As it would be pity to remove this litle safety device alltogether. I just seem to think that with a fair number of cars with this early arrangement someone might have organised a "spare" In Uk it seems no one has though other bits of new modern "Plastic" are available for suspension. I shal await further responces optimistically
melvyn simonson

After having had the roadster (solid column) fail its MOT in two successive years for play in the steering UJ that I was barely aware of, for several years after getting the V8 (collapsible column) with 1/4" of play at the rim I was worried that they were going to fail the column, but no. Then I get an 89 Celica and the workshop manual for that says up to 1/2" is no problem, but that has power steering to boot, don't know whether that adds to the play or what. I don't think there is any danger of the one shaft turning with respect to the other i.e. loss of steering, so as such I don't really think it is worth curing.
Paul Hunt

I got my steering whell a couple of days back, and have given Cory a few ideas to try that might work for him work. Oh and if ya'll have this problem again spray penetrating oil on the steering wheel shaft, let it sit over night and use a harmonic balancer puller, an impact wrench at the lowest setting, and a hot air gun (hair dryer) to heat up the shaft and wheel enough for the metal to expand slightly, spray more penetrating oil onto it while its slightly expanded to work into the crevices, then use the harmonic balancer puller and impact gun to pull it right off without a single problem. You really gotta be careful though those threads do not like the to be hit at all.
CJD Dark

Really want to thank CJD and Gerry. I haven't been able to work on the car - will this weekend, but your suggestions are great. Will let you know the outcome. Thanks.
Corey Gold

I thought my wheel was welded on. FWIW, eventually I used a cheap two legged puller, centred in the middle of the shaft. The legs had nothing good to grip so I placed a large spanner at the back of the boss and slotted the legs into the jaws of this. I tightened until there was plenty of tension (the spanner was flexed) and then followed someone's top tip of giving the puller shaft a sharp tap with a hammer. Satisfying ping and it all came apart. The shock of the tap with everything under tension was the key, otherwise I'm sure I could have kept tightening until I broke the spanner or puller.
Steve Postins

This thread was discussed between 24/03/2004 and 30/03/2004

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