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MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG TD TF 1500 - 45D distributor upgrade

I've combed the archive but haven't run across any details other than some have converted Mini (and others) 45D distributors.

There are some cheap knockoffs available. They're sold in the UK under the name Accuspark.

Why risk it? Solid state ignition, no condenser to blame when engine runs rough, distributor cap can't be any worse than the replacement Lucas caps (or can it?), there's a vacuum advance, virgin bushings (?) and the mechanical advance isn't 7 decades old.

Obviously, the gear must be installed but is it dimensionally a "drop in?"



JIM N

You can also use a 45D with traditional contact breaker points and get better reliability, plus easier to fix if something happens ( it won't). This is what I use.
Dave H
Dave Hill

Jim,
there'll be info on Accuspark in midget and Sprite Technical and MGB Technical. Many recommend them others like myself wouldn't risk it, I've had a 123igntion fitted to my 1973 Midget for the last 10+ years and I don't carry any spares in the boot, have used my car regularly all year round (it's my only car) and for tours and holidays, some in Europe.

Even when the mechanical dissys were new back in the day they were out of factory spec within a few years, they're mechanical bottom end, so just imagine how far some are out after decades of use, abuse and neglect, especially bottom end.

I'm not a big fan of Accuspark but I wouldn't say the dissy is a knock off, cheap yes, knock off no.

Personally I'd now look at CSI for fully electronic, top and bottom, dissy as it's from the same country as my 123 but uses Lucas instead of Bosch rotor and cap and has the timing curve adjuster more easily accessible, though I've never had mine adjusted despite a few rolling road tune-ups with an acknowledged MG tuning expert.

Once fitted to requirements and set up, which isn't difficult, you may want to make other ignition and fuel/air adjustments to take advantage of the improvements, slightly wider spark plug gap (+3 thou on mine) and adjust the carbs for the steadier running and other improvements. Obviously if you've got old worn HT leads and spark plugs then they may prevent you getting full advantage (but things will still be better even if they are). I'm not sure copper leads are best suited but Moss Europe don't make any mention against their use with the CSI.

You do need a 2.5+ ohm coil.

CSI do a "modified Lucas 23D housing, that will fit MG T-series" in negative or positive earth, both are non-vacuum but they do plenty of other variants including programmable if you're into racing or fiddling with computers.

Our Moss Europe, not a favourite supplier of mine, sells them and gives a lot of choice and information but normally sell at higher prices than some other suppliers.

CSI - http://www.csi-ignition.nl/en/home.html

Moss Europe - https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/shop-by-model/mg/t-type/electrical/ignition-system/csi-ignition-distributors-t-type-1.html

HTH.
Nigel Atkins

Dave,
I might be misunderstanding what you mean by better reliability. As you know over here we can get cheap crap points, condensers, rotor arms and caps or get good quality ones for a not a lot more cost, I think this is the same in the USA if Jeff? whosit is still going.

The 123 and CSI fully electronic dissys AFAIK are extremely reliable, certainly that's my personal experience of 123ignition fully electronic dissy (opposed to my experience of traditional dissys when the replacement parts were still good). The cheap under the cap, top part of the dissy, 'ignitors' did have some issues (not seen this mentioned more recently) but some of these problems seemed to be caused by poor installation by vehicle owners or mechanics, plenty to check out in M&S, B, A Archives.

As always it's each to their own in the debate of electronic fit 'n' forget against traditional farting about with adjustments and whether you want or need the running improvements the fully electronic give. 😄
Nigel Atkins

They are far more expensive to buy than a distributor with contact breakers, which remain incredibly reliable for thousands of miles. Certainly its unwise to buy ultra cheapo parts.
Dave H
Dave Hill

The Accuspark distributor caps are rubbish. The carbon brush wears very very quickly. The one on my Morris Minor did not last a year. With a decent cap the distributor is OK.
Regards
Declan
Declan Burns

I had a problem with the Accuspark side entry dizzy cap where the ignition leads they supplied with the cap wouldn't fit in the holes. Maybe 8mm instead of 7mm. In addition, it was possible to screw the anchorages for the leads through the cap so the screw points could be seen like moles trying to escape through the top of the cap. They look more a kind of plastic than earlier ones that were more like Bakelite. I've gone back to an old cap that's probably twenty/thirty years old.

Very cheap, though!
Peter Allen

Peter,
I agree very much. The replacement I bought was manufactured by FACET-Made in Italy (on the box). It is of very high quality. You can also get decent caps from "The distributor doctor" in UK.
Regards
Declan
Declan Burns

Dave,
totally agree the sales price is higher, just using Moss Europe as an example only, Lucas 45D4 replacement £152.90, CSI £281.16. The CB ones may (or may not) be reliable for thousands of miles but will probably need service adjustment.

The CB points type can be good but in my experience not as good as a fully electronic type. This may not matter if the vehicle isn't often used and full potential performance isn't wanted or required - but I thought TDs and TFs were meant to be sports cars so why wouldn't you want a constant, reliable and very long lasting improved performance (mpg, starting, idle, running, power).
Nigel Atkins

There are still lots of good dissy caps about (and lots of crap ones) I've always recommended the Distributor Doctor for his (true) 'Red Rotor' arm rather than the copies from Accuspark and Powerspark (SimomBBC) which I've bought (from both) and tested, they're fine for cost but didn't fill me with confidence for very long term use.

Others have used Accuspark HT leads and found them to be poor quality whilst others still have found them to be fine, the Powerspark HT leads maybe a lot better as they use Ferroflex which I've used for a good number of years with good results (surprised Peter Burgess on his rolling road, all in the M&S Archives).

It may be with the likes of Accuspark products that the quality control is even less than usual nowadays so if you're lucky you get a product that works (I've no idea how well or long for their dissys) or if you'reunlucky (like I usually am) you get a duff one. Better made products tend to be more consistent with build quality and quality of the parts used.

Dissy Doc - http://www.distributordoctor.com/
Nigel Atkins

I do wonder sometimes at the point of replacing stuff willy nilly if it ain't broken, which I used to do as a matter of course. The one noticeable difference I have seen is replacing old HT leads with decent new ones. As has been said, a lot of new stuff is pretty sub-standard (Distributor Doctor apart).

In my old Riley with DK4A distributor, which I've had for forty five years, I've never replaced the cap or soldered in condenser. I think I replaced the points maybe thirty or so years ago (NOS). Whereas, in my MGB I've replaced in a shorter period all those items on numerous occasions.
Peter Allen

Peter,
I'm with you, a lot more now I accept some things on the car as they are instead of trying to get them better or "upgraded" but I still think some owners keep some service parts far too long just because they're still working, your HT leads are a good example, just because something is still working doesn't mean it's not well passed it's optimum, best or even reasonably good working order.

Spare plugs are another, some don't even bother with cleaning and checking gaps.

Certainly there can now be modern made new parts that don't work as well as old worn parts.

I've been using various classics as everyday cars (not every day for la number of years now) for 30+ years, all year round, for previously work and 300 and 500 mile weekly commutes on top of their use for club runs, tours and holidays all have been used all through winters too and all sat outside 365. So I want reliable cars (I've never got that with British built cars) that I can drive in a spirited way if I feel like it so they need to be more than just working.

I've nothing against those that want to bimble around and sunny Sunday afternoon runs to local annual shows but I dislike the ideal of giving potential buyers that classics are just for that and are always unreliable and need to be babied along with loads of spares in the boot just in case of a once in decades incidence or being poorly maintained and/or not driven enough so the owner has no idea how well the car could or should go.

I understand that some want to protect the (over priced and over valued) sales values but if shiny show cars and unreliable slow, poor handling (and still over priced and over valued) cars carry on too far into the future there'll be no one to buy them at any price - unless they're converted to electric perhaps. 😁
Nigel Atkins

Yes, agree Nigel. What I have found is the more one uses a vehicle, the more reliable it gets. Funnily enough, I've found Brit cars can be reliable, but that you've got to shake them down over a number of miles, even if they're superficially in nice order when you first get them. When new, people bought them as daily drivers, parked them at the side of the road, and expected them to start on a winters morning. However, there was a point when they got to sixth hand and bought by people who just wanted a cheap sportscar to attract the opposite sort. I've had people come up to me and ask whether it's always breaking down as the one they had in the '80s was always having to be put into the shop. However, that does mean probably at least once a week I'm checking fluid levels and tyre pressures and if I hear a rattle I'm on the case.
Peter Allen

Jim, I installed Len's CSI dissy in my '53 TD and have been very happy with it. I have around 2K miles of fairly spirited driving since installation. The kit does not include ignition wires and my old bumble bee wires were not easily compatible so I have a set of NAPA wires that are all way too long but they seem to be working fine. The CSI dissy is made in Holland and seems to be very well made. T'weren't cheap but at my age I don't plan on buying another one.

Jud
J K Chapin

I fully agree, Peter. The more you drive them, the happier they are. I drive my '67 MGB GT daily. Points distributor, original generator, etc. It has been extremely reliable. My commute varies, but this week for example it's about 450 miles total. I've been driving this as my primary vehicle for 17 years. It has over 300,000 miles on it now (some of that was the original owner). It's only been towed once, for a defective brand new fuel pump. That will teach me to replace a working pump...

Quality condensers are available from two sources that I've found. Distributor Doctor in the UK (yellow wire) and British Vacuum Unit in the USA (blue wire). Avoid any condenser with an orange wire, they are all junk.

I, too, have had very good luck with original T-Type condensers. I've seen many of them still in use after 70 years including in my TC. Every now and then I see one fail but it's rare. Like the old saying goes, they don't make them like they used to. Then again, DD makes what he claims is an equivalent to the original, to be soldered in. But he also said the quality of the screw-in replacement type he sells are just as good. I haven't personally seen any DD or BVU condensers fail, but I've experienced numerous so-called Lucas orange wire units crap out, including those sold by another well known USA distributor rebuilder.
Steve Simmons

Agree, Steve, that the MGB can be the most practical and reliable of vehicles. I've had mine 37 years and bought it minus most of its engine (the chap that owned it had lent it to a friend who'd thrown a rod through the block). Subsequently used it to hillclimb/sprint, carry building materials, I even used it to pick up a spare engine by removing the passenger seat. Once I started buying decent parts for it, and being more thorough with my repairs, reliability picked up enormously.

I've heard with the orange wire condensers that there's a good chance that brand new ones are defective. The problem is they're so temptingly cheap that I installed a couple on my Triumph 650, as the original style fitment were a lot more expensive and I wasn't sure that the quality would be any better. So far, so good, but not holding my breath!

Peter Allen

This thread was discussed between 22/10/2021 and 23/10/2021

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