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MG TD TF 1500 - fog/driving lights

I am restoring a 54mgtf that has headlights but no fog or driving lights. If I add them do I add one of each, both driving or both fog, or just one lamp period (and if so which one)? Are they practical or just look good? Do they mount on a badge bar? Let me have the benefit of your advice.
Ed Eastman

I'd have to say they are mostly decorative these days, but depends on what technology of headlamps you are using (OEM vs. modern). But, if you live in an area that gets a lot of fog, a fog light is much better than a headlamp, as it is mounted much lower and has a better beam pattern for fog, reducing the reflected light from bouncing back. As for driving lights, they are better than old technology headlamps, but not as good or the same depending on bulb type, as modern halogen bulb headlamps. All of this is my opinion, of course, as I have one of each on my car (as yet hooked up). I think it's mainly a matter of taste, driving need, and individuality. My $.02 USD :-)

Larry
L Karpman

I have two... the driving light lights up the lower part of the road and covers both ditches...the spot has a beam that lights up about 1/2 mile...very bright. With the high beams and two lights on it is as good as any modern car I have owned...
Both mine are on the badge bar and have separate toggles on the left side of the wheel.

http://www.niagarabritishcarclub.org/gb/fall05/td274.jpg

Both are Lucas.....
gblawson - TD#27667

Hmmm...
I have a foglight and a driving (Lucas) light on the badge bar.

Thinking maybe that hanging two foglight underneath the bumper and two driving lights on the bar would work really well. ????

Any collective wisdom on this arrangement?

Just wonderin...


Best regards,

DaveL
dave lackey

With my 4 lights on and on high beam, my ammeter is just at 0...maybe a tiny bit below... Am sure it would take the two extra lights, but wouldn't have them all on at once!
Not sure how long they would last below the bumper with stones and such?
gblawson - TD#27667

I bought two original Lucas when I restored in 1970's I think they are called 576. There were four options back then: driving lights with clear non-fluted lens and amber non-fluted. And there were fog fluted lens in clear and amber. I bought the non-fluted amber driving as they looked neat. Still have them (2) on with guards over them. Mounted on badge bar.

Keith Murphy

Lucas made tons of models... a friend yesterday showed me a 'flame thrower' he just got ...it was at least 8"...I know the ones I used to buy ('60's) was about 6"....(and $14.95).
These are mine:
http://www3.sympatico.ca/gordonblawson/td/td97.jpg
http://www3.sympatico.ca/gordonblawson/td/td98.jpg

gblawson - TD#27667

Ed,
I run one of each: Lucas SFT 576 fluted and non-fluted amber lens (fog & driving) lamp on my TF. Mounted to badge bar. My set-up is a little "different". The factory installed wiring from the aux switch on the TF dash only has 1 wire that runs to front of the car for this. I installed a small "aux" pannel under my dash and extra fusing & relays. From my pannel I can "pre-select" accesories that will operate from the factory aux switch.
With the lamps I can select either one or both to come on with the factory aux, switch "up", leave them off, switch in middle poss, or with the switch "down" they work via relay as turn signals. I use them as turn signals in bright daylight as the little wing units are somewhat hard to see. (also have modified the rear "1500" reflectors to work as turn & brake lamps). I live near a lake so use the fog lamp a lot...works great! The amber driving lamp is very bright & wide and I have noticed I have fewer deer meander into the road in front of the TF when it is on. Not sure why...maybe just because they are not sure what I am as it is very unuasual? But we have a lot of deer around here.
You can take a look at my set-up for switches here:
http://www.ttalk.info/Sheward.htm
Cheers,
David 55 TF1500 #7427
David Sheward

Ed,

Just for your info-TCs were originally supplied with a Lucas FT27 foglamp then later moved to a Lucas
462 foglamp.It seems early TDs had this lamp also,then moved to Lucas 576 lamps.In England I believe that people had one SFT 576(foglamp,rib lense) and one SLR(driving spotlamp,clear lense) set up on the standard Badge Bar.TFs ditto.

In Australia we are not worried about deer,however Kangaroos are indeed another matter!! I have a pair of the standard Lucas SLR Spotlamps on our current TF.

Cheers
Rob. Grantham
R GRANTHAM

Oops...Rob is correct I left the "SLR" out of my posting! It is one bright lil' sucker! We have "clear" driving lamps on our other cars ...but the deer still jump out in front of them all the time. I am not sure why they don't seem to jump out in front of the TF as much when these are on. Maybe they just like "T" cars...or maybe I need to adjust the tappets more offten! LOL.
David Sheward

Hi David,

Great to see you on the side of Lucas! These lights actually do work and work well when the reflectors are in good condition. You know the usual jokes re Lucas products and all -Lucas "The Prince of Darkness"etc..seem to pervade the English classic car movement.I have always felt that the Lucas quality particularly up to the 1960's was excellent value for money.The original 576 lamp body shells were decently made out of good quality brass.

Deer and Kangaroo don't appear to like these lamps-so be it!

Cheers
Rob.Grantham

R GRANTHAM

Gord Lawson makes a good point. How much do you drive your T, at night?

Although I have removed mine, for years I ran a Lucas 576 lamp, pointed about 30 feet ahead at the right ditch, and wired to the 'A' (auxilliary) switch on the panel. I can assure you, that on many occasionas, they were much more than decorative! Especially in rain.

The reason I removed miine, was a matter of not wanting to overload the generator. When I replaced my tripods with the Sylvania Silver Stars, I noticed that I needed at least 2000 revs to keep the ammeter needle on the + side. I have a heater too. So discretion weighed in and I decided that I no longer needed the ditch lamp with the new and properly aimed, very bright Silver Stars.

I can't imagine what running TWO auxilliary lamps AND the headlamps would do on current load, and I would certainly be concerned about blowing the generator while driving down a very dark and rainy road far away from help!

Gord Clark
Rockburn, Qué.
Gordon A. Clark

Okay,
been reading this thread with interest and now I want to know how to increase the generator power. Seems I have read of changing to an expensive alternator that looks like the oe part but what is the best (cost-effective) method of upgrading the generator so I can run the following:

1. Driving light, Lucas (installed but not hooked up)
2. Fog light, Lucas (installed but not hooked up)
3. Heater

and,


cough, cough,....


maybe even the Moss seat heaters!!! LOL...

Octagonally trippin...

DaveL
dave lackey

Dave L,

Best solution - don't do it. I doubt your wiring system can handle it unless you order a new harness with #14 or #12 wire for the lighting system, and install relays everywhere there's a big load.

Trying to overload the system will almost certainly have a domino effect.

Using the water anology: its like putting a huge pump at one end of a small pipe or tube, and trying to push zillions of litres of water down an impossible pipe to turn a half dozen turbines at the other end! The pipe will burst sending water all over the place.

Now, just replace the hydraulic terms with electrical ones, and you'll get the message!

Gord Clark
Rockburn, Qué.



Gordon A. Clark

Which makes sense but auxiliary lights have been used for years. The heater should not be much of a draw. And I could...sniff...do without the seat heaters, I guess.

Just trying to figure a way to make the TD a better/safer touring machine rather than a runabout!

Best regards,

DaveL
dave lackey

I've had Lucas Driving lights (2) on both my TD and TF for many years and they have proved to be invaluable on many dark and rainy nights while traveling. Both cars have them mounted on badge bars above the front bumper. I would not mount them below for fear of stones etc damaging the lenses. One time we were traveling from Watkins Glen NY to Binghamton NY at night during a driving rain storm. I was driving the TD and my son was driving the TF while my second son followed in his Healey Sprite. (also with Lucas driving lights) Without those lights I don't know how we would have ever made the trip safely. They were a necessary and much appreciated accessory. I also have a set on my MBG rear mounted to the grille.

George Herschell
George R Herschell

Hey, Gord...
Those Sylvania Silver Stars...are those the bulb replacements for the standard headlight or a separate headlight? Sounds like a good deal for night driving...


thanks,

DaveL
dave lackey

"and,
cough, cough,....
maybe even the Moss seat heaters!!! LOL..."

Dave... what would you do up here... Georgia doesn't get that cold does it????
gblawson - TD#27667

Ha ha!!! Nothing like where YOU are...that's for sure. We get 15F weather a lot but no snow...or rarely anyway.

But, the seat heaters would be nice for my better half who seems to chill a lot quicker nowadays since she has been on blood thinners...

Me? I love it cold...been commuting everyday by motorcycle 150 miles a day for the last three years. Of course, a leetle heated grip/heated seat combo didn't hurt... LOL I did cheat didn't I???? [wink]
dave lackey

Seems we get into this "load" conversation all the time.....One thing I do notice is TD owners seem to be more concerned about it than TF owners.
Could have something to do with the genny...TF is a bit "meatier"..correct?
Not by much but curious ...can a TF genny be fitted to a TD?
Would it be worth the effort?
I did not think there was much differance... but this does seem to come up offten!
Cheers,
David 55 TF1500 #7427
David Sheward

oh yea ...Rob ..I am very happy with Lucas... 120% of my Lucas components work flawlessly in all 3 modes:
DIM / FLICKER / and OFF ! LOL.... Just kidding...my sft & slr lamps are not rusted like my "neighbors" repros ....mine are 50 years old ...his less than a year old!
David Sheward

Davud S,
It must be that TG owners complain more since the generator is the same Lucas model for both (18 amp output).
The TC generator was different, but not the TD & TF.

I have 576 Fog lights on my TF with the original generator.
Don Harmer

Don H. -- The ratings I have been able to find say that early TD generators were C39PV service No. 22257A and were rated 17 Amps. Late TD's and TF's were C39PV/2 with a service No. 22265B and were rated 19 Amps. If you got a replacement you may have a C40/1 which was rated 22 Amps. There is also a C40L rated 25 Amps.

Hope this helps clear the muddle.
Bob

PS Moss says their P/N 140-300 is rated 22 Amps.
R. K. (Bob) Jeffers

A C40 generator is 4.0" in diameter while a C39 is 3.9" in diameter. Thus you can't use a C40 unless you disregard the tack drive made for the C39 units.

I wired the fog into the factory fog lamp circuit. I wired the driving lamp into a seperately fused three position switch. Position 1 is off. Position 2 syncs the lamp with the high beams. Postition 3 is always on. This has saved me twice. Once when the floor dip switch malfunctioned and blew the fuse installed for the headlamps while going 60 mph in the dark country. A quick flick of the driving lamp switch restored it so I could see. The second time it was a fuse blowing in the headlamp circuit this time at around 65 mph on a interstate. The driving lamp is on it's own fuse when in position three.

Blake
Bullwinkle

This thread was discussed between 30/10/2006 and 03/11/2006

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