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MG TD TF 1500 - Guess the winning bid

I amuse myself sometimes by trying to guess the value of ebay cars. Anyone else with me here?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Vehicle-Not-Titled-Bill-of-Sale-Only_W0QQitemZ4564688216QQcategoryZ31858QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I think 3500 is the max

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1952-MG-TD-GREEN_W0QQitemZ4564886886QQcategoryZ31858QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

Why hasn't this one sold at the buy it now price? Lack of pics and description? I think it's a reasonable buy it now.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1950-MG-TD-Matching-Numbers_W0QQitemZ4565170212QQcategoryZ31858QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I'm guessing 16.5K. Nice car.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1952-MG-TD-Dark-Blue-w-Tan-Interior-Excellent-Cond_W0QQitemZ4564793765QQcategoryZ31858QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

I don't think he'll make his reserve. It's tasteful, but it's ebay.

Enough for now.
Tom

If anyone is interested in the last one (Buffalo, N.Y.)...i'm not that far away.
gordon lawson - TD 27667

Item #4565170212 (the white one) is a little bizarre as there is nothing mounted on the firewall/front of dash. Not even a battery tray with a battery in it. very mysterious.
Greg & Grimm
G.J. Cenzer

How about those dished faced instruments in a 1950 (the white one with no battery box).
Ernest Betts

Greg
It appears to have been "scuttled" during restoration? John
John C. Hambleton III

Did anybody see the end of the yellow, V-8 powered one the other day?

John
John Redman

The white one sure is strange I would bet it has a fiberglass body. Only one wiper and the motor is in front of the driver. The exhaust manifold is wrong, may not be a TD engine? The headlights are quite different as well, same as a YA? For a value of $16,500? no way! but then again, there is a seat for every crate.

Tom,

What is this one worth? It didn't meet it's reserve on E-bay but it did sell the old fashion way in a day out to the street.
Ron Boisvert

It would help if I included the link http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4560769206&ssPageName=STRK:MEUS:IT
Ron Boisvert

Interesting question, Ron, about the one that sold on the street (4560769206). Judging from the black interior (very tired, and not pleasant to sit in, mine had such an interior for 20 years) and the rust on the body, I'm guessing the wood is not going to be as solid as he thinks. Even if you do the work yourself and don't have to go through the engine, I think it will take about $12-15k to bring this car to a reasonable state, if you raise the rearend ratio, and go frame off.

From that view, anything over $8K sounds too much.

warmly,
dave
D. A. Braun

Well I got an email answer from the chap that is selling the wierdo/white one. Seems "the battery is behind the driver","fuel pump is in the rear", and he/she has no more pics. The pic showing the top up the front rail is resting on the windscreen frame but the links for the bows are not fully locked up and if you did lock them up it looks like the front rail will miss the windscreen.
Greg & Grimm
G.J. Cenzer

"Battery behind the driver" and "fuel pump in the rear" say MGB to me, although most TF's have fuel pump in the back, also. Aren't there a couple of TD kit cars based on the MGB? I know there is an TF kit for the MGB which is actually OK, but not a real TF.
Mark B.

D A,

The rust isn't as bad as you think. With the exception of the patch behind the driver's door and the bit of rust coming under one door, there isn't any "bad" rust. The rest is surface rust where the paint fell off. The drivers top door hinge was bad and when it was changed the door wood is good as well as the door post and sill, couldn't penetrate the wood with an awl. This car wouldn't take as much as you would think. There are much worse out there that look better. As one observer said, at least you know it's a real one.

As for the seats, they are as comfortable as could be expected, I suppose if they were red they would be more comfortable? As this group has seen, there are fresh "rebuilt" engines that cost more to fix right after the rebuild than this old one that was driven over 900 mile in the last month without a problem. The biggest mistake is to assume a car that has a good paint job from 50' is the better car and would take less to restore. There is no telling how much plastic, or rotted wood has been hidden. This one would in the long run be cheaper to paint, less paint and filler to remove. The car sold for $8,750 with several buyers in line in case the deal fell through.
Ron Boisvert

Well, Ron. I took a guess based on the pictures I saw, and my $8k price isn't far off the selling price of $8750. I guess you know a lot more about the car than I do. I would say that interiors often photograph worse than they look in person. I factored in the cost of a new interior into my estimate because I've noticed when the people I know are restoring a TD, they haven't been big on a black interior, nor have they purchased one to install. I have a nice terry towel I would lay down on my seat before I drove it, the black vinyl just seemed to scorch if I were wearing shorts. Maybe red does the same, I can't say. Do you think I'll have better luck with green?

I would never assume that a good restoration wouldn't include new paint, so I actually didn't factor the surface rust at all, just the penetrated rust. Actually, paint falling off is something I have much experience with!

I apoligize if I didn't come up with the answer you were looking for. I've spent $750 more then I intended on something I really wanted before... the last time was when I helped a friend out and spent $8k on the TD I am restoring now. And $8K bought a whole lot more in 1987. I'm certain I'll never get my monetary value from my restoration, but I figure it is still cheaper and more fun than getting a lower handicap in golf. In the final analysis a car is worth what someone will pay for it. I'm glad this car fetched something closer to what you felt the value was.

Warmly,
Dave
D. A. Braun

Looks like I'm not the only one that amuses themselves this way. Thanks for your experienced comments, it teaches me a lot!
Tom

Dave,

I think your selling price was good. What I'm saying is too many people are basing the price on the outside apperance rather than the proper parts. Take this one for instance. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4559191936&rd=1&sspagename=STRK:MEWA:IT This one has more rust through than the red one but from a distance it looks good. Now add in the missing or damaged parts (the gauges for instance, with the photo enlarged are pretty sad) an engine etc and now you will be spending serious money.

As for the green interior, that has a comfort setting at 110-130lbs whereas the black interior is set for 230-250lbs I was hoping to put green on the wife's side and black on mine when I finish my 52

Regards,
Ron

PS my first TD was a $2,000 special and it ran. The red TD in comparison would have been a bargain and much cheaper to restore.
Ron Boisvert

LOL Ron! Now for sure I'll keep my black interior, what with the built in margin for potential weight gain!

I agree with you that 4559191936 would be a tougher restoration. Given what you've added to my knowledge of 4560769206 I would much rather have the former than the latter one, given the choice. Here is a car which I just passed up on, given the constraints of my garage, time and budgets:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4564187994&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&rd=1

Choices are made all the time, one of the things which makes this hobby so facinating. But like marriage, once you are into the process, it is a bit hard to back out. I bet I'll regret in a year not giving that c
Charger a chance.

The car I'm doing now:

http://www.funpilot15.photosite.com/MGTDRebuild/

I purchased in 1987 from a dear friend who used to keep it at my place since about 1980. I knew the wood was rotting, and it didn't run quite right. My long association with the car allowed me to get to know it too well before I bought it, but I still did. I rebuilt some minor systems (brakes, carbs) as the wood slowly went to far. I collected my 'rebuild library' drove it about 12,000 miles in 18 years with low compression in cylinder one, running a tad rich, and endured paint and wood flaking off the car. I watched my two sons learn to drive a manual on this car, something I probably would have been concerned about had the car been already restored. The car gave us an additional common ground over which to discuss all the things you want to cover with your sons as they grow up. I emailed them last Spring to see if they objected to me taking the car out of service for a year (as a courtesy, by that time they had more miles on the car each year than I did). Although they don't share my enthusiasm for auto mechanics, they enjoy the results of my boat and car escapades!

It is incredibly hard for me to keep a sane monetary discipline when it comes to this little car, it means too much to me. Often at night I argue with myself about originality vs. cost vs. what I really want, hence the raised rear end ratios, and the plan to go ivory over green with green wings which may change to just ivory over green! It is much easier for me to be objective about other cars or airplanes, such as the Dodge Charger I didn't buy, or the value of such items on ebay.

I always remember that taken at face value my car looked complete and good, but there is not a system or component that is not being opened up or repaired (read expensive, LOL). There is very little cost difference between rebuilding a very loose suspension or a better one, if included in your goal is to have a restored car that looks one to two years old. The truest thing in the world (and as you said) was to be able to start off with most (if not all) the correct bits, especially the expensive ones. Finding a starting handle or a tonneau bar is a lot easier than finding an engine, and having the right number on your engine is better still.

Thanks for the provocative discussion, and the opportunity to consider this issue from both of our viewpoints.

Warm regards,
dave
D. A. Braun

Dave,

Take this one as an example http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4564706645&rd=1&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT#ebayphotohosting the body looks great, right? the paint isn't perfect only has some cracking and it has "no rust" I will say I wish I had the interior for my 52. Now take a good look, The cracking in the paint I would say is bondo? yes? no? Look at the photo that was meant to show the chipped paint on the running board, you know that expansion seam between the front and rear quarter panels, this one doesn't have one. Another thread question the year of the car, 53 windshield, an unknow wiper motor, round tail lights with painted plinths, note the number plate location, the bud vase single horn (this is where you leaves fresh flowers and a little green to bribe the judges) cracking in the bondo, I mean paint in front of the door, green painted frame, new suspension?? a lot of green went on that! and don't forget the special black face amp gauge for these years (may be several of them here)and the custom horn button, no ID tag on the block, extra screws in front of the drivers door and extra fasteners behind the door and for what I can tell by enlarging the photo by 200%, the is rust bubbling the paint behind them, rear view mirror is wrong and I don't see a directional switch and my favorite ..... the early engine with the remote fiter 1949-Feb 52 "Engine number: XPAG/TD2/26287 "

What's this one worth??

Regards,
Ron
Ron Boisvert

Ron, the green car has met its reserve. It's not perfect, by a long shot. And it may need $10K and a lot of sweat to make it really nice. But I think it'll bring at least $12K. It's too nice for me (unless my neighbor was selling it for $5K, then it would be mine).

Re: the red one with that was run-down..I would have liked to have that one, but if it brought over $8K, I think it was a foolish purchase. If my neighbor had it for $3000, it would be mine.

As far as I know, none of my neighbors have a TD hidden away.
Tom

Tom,

I assume that you would buy by looks only? and oringinal equipment isn't a factor in your purchase? I look at every car as individual parts, what it's lacking and what it has extra. I also factor in the right equipment. Other than the top & interior and a good paint job from 50', what was the difference in the red and green cars? To restore, which was/is the better value?
Ron Boisvert

I think this is a fair price for a MG TF 1250 year 1954 sold on E-bay
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4563943777
Jan Bierling

Ron, you really take this seriously, don't you? I would rather have the red car at the lower price. If I were going to restore or not. It would just be more urgent to start working on Red.
Tom

I would say that was a great deal... pretty low price for a TF on the road?
gordon lawson - TD 27667

I dislike the fact that none of these cars has the right parts in the right place - I mean especially the air filter.

Denis
Denis L. Baggi

When the cars were purchased, the first thing that came out was the accessory catalogue....I mean,no one wanted a "show room" car! The desire to return them to "factory" is actually kind of strange... every car has a history that makes little personality changes...When the little pancake air cleaners came out...whewwww... like who wanted that old "chevy" style sitting there when you could have a "racing" type?
Anyway... if the mechanicals are good, you can re-showroom the rest.
gordon lawson - TD 27667

Nicely said, Gordon. As TD owners we can paint our cars any color we want in the MG color selection. But how many cars were resprayed, or had the wings done in a contrasting color, before they ever left the show room. So many people paint their TDs red that the color "resell red" is used as gentle humor. I'm not criticizing the red cars, or those who want to have a completely factory example, but I do want something a little different. My car won't be so much about seeing how much more better than the factory I can go, (and we know that the factory wasn't consistent in how they built these cars, parts on hand were used as needed) it will be about how nicely I can add a few touches to make the car tastefully unique. That's why I say I want a restoration to a two year old car.

If the mechanicals are good, you can do almost anything you want.

dave
D. A. Braun

This thread was discussed between 29/07/2005 and 02/08/2005

MG TD TF 1500 index

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