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MG TD TF 1500 - MG TF's from Germany

I have tried this thread before and never received any comments on it.

Just a few weeks ago I had a call from Tom Booth of Birmingham, MI USA and he told me that he had (for 30 yrs) 1954 TF HD?/6663, 1250 cc, Black, Body 36335. I discovered that this car had come originally from Germany and has dealer emblem on the right bonnet side.
It is a gold and black shield with the octagon emblem in the center of a profile of the Cologne Cathedral,
It is inscribed Imported by J. H. Woodhouse. J.H.W. in the octagon. Koln Braunsfeld Stolberg Str. 110. Tel. 543665??0.
I believe J H Woodhouse was the MG importer in Ger. prior to WWII.
My car, HDC 6688 has a Ger. dealer emblem which is a bright blue oval surrounded by small silver leaves. It is inscribed
Nufield Products. Chr. Odendahl. Frankfurt/M. Tel 64336

I have been told that Christian Odendahl was the MG dealer in Frankfurt after WWII, and also was a MG race driver for a team of PA's owned Woodhouse prior to WWII.

Anybody out there have a car with these emblems on them, or can further elaborate or confirm the story line.
colin stafford

Hi Colin
What is the ident number after HDC? If the car was exported to Germany it should be 36 (3 - LHD export cars and 6 - (red) cellulose finish on body and synthetic finish on wings. Someone in the MGOC in Germany might be able to help you. Try Gary Leek in Munster garyleek@compuserve,com
John
John James

The Booth car number is HDA/46 6663, 36335, Body 17203.
Our car which can be documented as being sold in Ger. has the HDC/46 6688, 36352, Body 17249. numbers on it.
No sign of 36. Being that these two cars were built within a few days of each, they might be part of an export batch. In all likelyhood, these were cars sent to Germany for a sales promotion with American GI's.
They cannot be the only two around.
colin stafford

Hi Colin
It looks like an interesting story developing here. Please keep us [ TF aficionados ]informed.
Thanks. Art
Art Mafli

Colin: I sent this thread off to Mike Walsh who can help you.

Chris
Chris Couper

Hi Colin
According to the code The Booth car (HDA 46) came out of the factory as a Black North American export car, usually LHD. A = Black 4 = North America 6 = cellulose body finish and synthetic paint on wings. Your car is the same but was Red. Your GI theory fits well. It would be interesting to know how long it took to drive from Germany to the States!
John
John James

I have TD29744 which has the J. H. Woodhouse badge on the right lower hood (bonnet) panel so the badge is not only on the TF. I have seen 4-5 other TD's with the badge over the last several years and all seem to be late serial number cars. A few years ago the "The Sacred Octagon" from the new England "T" Register had an article on Woodhouse, who made a handfull of TD's by buying rolling chassis from MG and hand fitting a copy of the body made in Germany from photos of the British cars.

I wonder if these cars were included in the count of cars exported to Germany or North America in the factory records as mine is identified as a North America specification vehicle.

Jan
Janson Hurd

Janson...I am aware of the Woodhouse MG's that were bodied in Germany due to a post war steel shortage in the UK. I have seen one of them and they are different from the standard body as they were made from a set of photos and not actual blueprints. I have never been able to get a copy of that NEMGTR article. A couple of years ago Adreas Pichler sent me a memo about the these cars and how they were made by a coachbuilder named Hennefarth near Stuttgart.About 30 of these cars (TD) were built.
A couple of years ago I found a 1954 US Forces in Germany, License plate which was like to one on our car when it came back from Ger.
colin stafford





I remember reading the article some time back. I can dig it out, but it would help if I knew roughly when it was printed. I remember that the center bead of the rear fenders was different from the factory fenders and that the door latches were also different. Can't recall any other details.

Time to start digging.
John Masters

One of these (GERMAN) TD,s is in Clearwater Florida. The fuel tank is larger, The windscreen frame is cast aluminum, Outer door handles sames as TD but the interior latches are different, Hood latches are spring loaded hooks like Model A Ford. The louvers on the bonnet are all the same length. The rear wings are "D" in shape a little bit wider and do not have a central ridge. Tail lights are on rear valance.The firewall is totally smooth, no ridges.As it has been at least 15 years since I last saw this car there may be other differences that I have overlooked.We always referred this car as being the T-EEE. or missing link. This was long before we realized that it was a real jewel in the TD-line.There used to be a black TD in Jacksonville that was plaqued as being made in Germany but there were no major changes from a regular TD.
Sandy Sanders
conrad sanders

Actually..I am more interested in the TD/TF's that came from German dealers and have the side body emblems on them. These were regular production cars.
Where the MG's exported to Germany for domestic sale different in S/N than those exported to the US?

A whole lot has been written about the special bodied cars and a very good lecture was given at the Univ. Motors Summer Party (MI) some years ago.
colin stafford

Yes Colin the numbers were different. TF's all started with HD followed by a colour letter A to P. Next came a two digit number. 1 - home market RHD. 2 -RHD export . 3 LHD export. 4-North American export usually LHD. The second digit was 3, 5 or 6 indicating the type of paint.
TD's were coded differently for LHD with kph speedos and mph speedos. American codes changed over the years. Have you tried emailing any MGOC members in Germany for help?
John
John James

John I tried the Gary Leek email but it bounced.
colin stafford

I thank Chris Couper for bringing this to my attention. I too have a JAW TF and have put together a short article on what I know about this MG agency and the cars. So here goes and sorry about the length: J. A. Woodhouse MG Agency

The J. A. Woodhouse MG agency in Koln dates from the 1920s beginning as a British motorcycle agency. Jack Woodhouse was a British Army officer from the Great War, WWI, who remained in Germany after the War. In 1927 Jack marries Rita who helps him build the motorcycle agency into a successful enterprise. Later, she convinces Jack to accept Cecil Kimbers offer of an MG agency stating all will go well. Indeed, all does goes well for the Woodhouse agency as Germany becomes one of the prime export markets for MGs during the 1930s. These successes are also the basis of a life long friendship with George Tuck who will play a major role after WWII in establishing a new J. A. Woodhouse MG agency. At the outbreak of hostilities in 1939, Rita and Jack escaped to England where they would remain for the duration of WWII.
At the end of the war, Rita and Jack were planning to buy a farm in England but a chance meeting with George Tuck , then Nuffield Export director, convinced Rita and Jack to return to Koln to reestablish their MG agency. Before long the J. A. W. MG agency was reestablished and selling MG-TCs to Americans who were part of the army of occupation thus creating the beginning of the stream of MGs coming to the United States from Europe. I have seen TDs, TFs and MG-As with the J. A. Woodhouse plaque. I have not seen a TC so if anyone has a TC with such a plaque, I would be interested in knowing where the plaque was located and any other unique features.
The plaque is a U shaped shield with a black background on brass held onto the car with three screws one each in the upper left and right as well as at the middle of the bottom of the shield. In the middle of the plaque is the twin spires of the Koln cathedral with JAW within an octagon in the middle and the words Imported By J. A. Woodhouse following the outline of the U shaped body of the plaque while their agency address is immediately below the basic shape on a separate line. The plaques seem to be found always on the right hand side of the car. On the TD, its on the right hand side of the bonnet side immediately behind the aft latch. The location on the TF is on the body immediately aft of the rubber cowl strip and above the fender welting, forward of the passenger door. On the MG-A, its on the right front fender immediately aft of the right front wheel on the vertical side immediately behind the wheel opening before the fender curves down to the lower trim strip.
Personally, I did not live in Germany during this time period so I can only speculate that the J. A. Woodhouse MG agency may have had a tie-in with the U. S. armed forces post exchange where a member of the U. S. occupation forces may order an MG for delivery in Germany. I do know there were tie-ins in other countries, namely England and France, where one could purchase an English car to take home via the PX. Since these cars were intended for the US North American market, they would be so noted the TDs would be either LHX or EXL/NA with degree F and miles instruments. The TFs/ MG-As would be 46 - not 36 as some have mentioned as the intended market would be North American not Germany. Also, these TFs would have degree F and miles instruments whereas the German home market cars would have degree C and kilometer instruments. All MG models would have the Lucas Continental bulb type headlights as exported to North America and which the dealers would have to change out for sealed beams before delivery to the customer to meet US standards.
Rita Woodhouse obituary in the Jan / Feb 2001 issue of Safety Fast provided much of the historical information presented above. She lived to be 102! Also mentioned in the above article is that the J. A. Woodhouse agency was included in an MG book written by Hagen Nynckes. Does anyone know of this book? I would like to know more about this unique MG agency as I also own a 1954 MG-TF sold by J. A. Woodhouse. Please feel free to email me with any additional information you may have. Thank you- Mike Walsh
Mike Walsh

Colin,
I have a TD (EXL-NA 28652) that has the same emblem in the same location. The mystery continues.
roy babylon

Colin
I have emailed you two more German addresses and corrected Gary Leek's
John
John James

Mike........you must be a good typist to do a report like that. Thanks for the contribution. In my research I have found that Chr. Odendahl, who was the MG dealer in Frankfurt/M after WW2 did race a trio of MG's (PA's)proir to the outbreak of war in 1939. These PA's probably came from J.A.Woodhouse. From all accounts he was fairly succesfull driver. This association with JAW led to him being appointed as a dealer in Frankfurt.
Our car TF6688 was a so called "G.I. Export car, and was bought by Wm. Johnson, of Lansing, MI. He brought the car back from Germany in 1956 and sold it to my wife's cousin.
Our car has the orig. Lucas LHD 700 headlights. All the instruments are "english".
It would be interesting to find out how many of these cars acutally flowed thru this military conduit and into the USA.
In August I am giving a luncheon speech on how the post war importation of the MG started a sports car trend in America. Your infomation is very helpful.

colin stafford

Janson/Colin

I note your reference to special-bodied Woodhouse MGs in the TSO. I have looked through all of my TSO's going back to issue 1, and found only an article on the Perl MG, by Peter Sowinski, with photos from the extensive archives of Dick Knudson in the August 1998 TSO; that bears any resemblance to special bodies mentioned in your posting.

These were a handful of at least 5 special-bodied TDs and perhaps more, as the article alludes to an alloy-bodied roadster that could seat 3-across in the front, that were in fact, made in Vienna, Austria and not Germany, and I’m wondering if you could have mixed these up.

Unfortunately, the photos in the article show only the left side of the car, so there’s no way of knowing if a badge had ben added, but my guess is that if these cars were sent to Woodhouse, it was likely Woodhouse that added the badge, and not Perl.

In any event, I have asked Dick to have a look, and perhaps he can put us all straight.

Regards,

Gord Clark
Rockburn, Qué.
Gordon A. Clark

(clears throat delicately)

hello.

seeking white welting for '53 MGTD.

thanks.
b.k. aberlin

There is a Woodhouse TF for sale on this BB's Classified section right now (July 17).
Bud Krueger

I finally found the phone number for owner of one of the "German Bodied" cars, its Robert W. Wilson, Lisle IL. Bob has one of these MG's and I plan to call him get his lowdown on the car. He has a large collection of Brit cars, races a Morgan in Historic races and is one of the elite judges for the Meadowbrook Concours.
colin stafford

This thread was discussed between 11/05/2004 and 21/06/2004

MG TD TF 1500 index

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