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MG TD TF 1500 - My TD Radiator Issues


I tried to upload my full post several times to no avail.
This is a partial upload on the assumption there is a size limit.

I have owned my TD for over 55 years now. It last ran in 1958 or 1959
I have come to believe that at one time it was raced and the engine or the flywheel blew. The firewall area has been repaired. The engine numbers do not match.

It never had a “true” MG radiator.(A fact I did not know when I purchased it).
The radiator;
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/mystery-radiator.jpg
is of German Manufacturer

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Dr-Mfg-Plate-1.jpg

And was apparently rebuilt in Boston Ma.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Rebuild-Plate.jpg

I have always believed that this modification was to enhance the cooling of the car.

I believe I want to return the cooling system to a normal configuration.

If this works I will add additional information.
JA Benjamin

(That worked)
I bought the car in Needham, Mass from a long-gone dealer called Cochrane Motors, on Route #9

The chrome shell was mangled and never fit right.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Cutouts-.jpg

Note also that the TD style radiator support has been removed.
(The Armstrong shock has been replaced with a Girling to match the other side.)

Also the tie bar that attaches to the brackets which bolt to the headlamp supports has been bent and cut and extended.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Tie-bar-modifications.jpg

and those brackets have also been bent.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/brackets-bent.jpg



I decided, even though the car ran fine, in Florida, with the existing modification I would return it to a more “standard” configuration.
JA Benjamin

I recently got a TD radiator off eBay that had cooled a Corvette powered TD. It has a non standard lower connection, but the price was good.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Buggered-Lower-connection.jpg

I hope to undo t the large inlet pipe modification, perhaps with the one on my “non-standard” radiator and plug up the hole in the bottom with brass sheet.

The present lower pipe seems to be correct or close to correct.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Right--side-old-radiator.jpg


I believe this cooling system was pressurized.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/My-assembly.jpg

However after removal of this adaption the cap seems usable.

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f334/eeengineer1/FIfty%20Year%20Restoration%20of%20my%201951%20MGTD/Fits-the-core.jpg

With an extra hole however,
I believe I need to:

1) Find a support channel
2) Return the headlamp tie bar and brackets to their original condition.
3) Replace the lower radiator connection.
4) Fix the radiator cap.

I do not intend to do anything with the shell at this time. They seem to be going for $450 to $550 and I need other things to make the car run, that are better uses of my (limited) funds.

Now the questions for the group are:

Did I miss something?
Am I off base in doing this?
I believe the “standard” configuration is not pressurized. What relieves the pressure?

Thanks.


Jim B.
JA Benjamin

None of those links seem to work for me.
Bob
Bob Jeffers

You are right, the standard TD system is not pressurized.
So there is nothing needed to releave the pressure.
Bob
Bob Jeffers

I had composed this in Word to use my spell checker, all the links worked then.
Clicking here breaks the link.

I am sorry for messing this up.
I am going to try a tiny URL for the first link.

http://tinyurl.com/3pwuzk7

If this does not work I will give up on this post.


Thanks for putting up with me.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

Jim, your tiny worked, but why don't you just post the pictures here directly? Click the "Upload" link on the bottom of this page.
efh Haskell

I seem to be only able to post one pix per post. Is posting of multiple pictures allowed?

Anyway here is the first post redone.
If this is acceptable I will continue.

I have owned my TD for over 55 years now. It last ran in 1958 or 1959
I have come to believe that at one time it was raced and the engine or the flywheel blew. The firewall area has been repaired. The engine numbers do not match.

It never had a “true” MG radiator.(A fact I did not know when I purchased it).
The radiator;

http://tinyurl.com/3pwuzk7

is of German Manufacturer

http://tinyurl.com/3heay4m

And was apparently rebuilt in Boston Ma.

http://tinyurl.com/3c73jah


I have always believed that this modification was to enhance the cooling of the car.

I bought the car in Needham, Mass from a long-gone dealer called Cochrane Motors, on Route #9

The chrome shell was mangled and never fit right.

http://tinyurl.com/3qkmq7v

Note also that the TD style radiator support has been removed.
(The Armstrong shock has been replaced with a Girling to match the other side.)
JA Benjamin


Here is the rest with the URL's replaced.

Also the tie bar that attaches to the brackets which bolt to the headlamp supports has been bent and cut and extended.

http://tinyurl.com/3qrq4c5

and those brackets have also been bent.

http://tinyurl.com/42w2jko


I decided, even though the car ran fine, in Florida, with the existing modification I would return it to a more “standard” configuration.

I recently got a TD radiator off eBay that had cooled a Corvette powered TD. It has a non standard lower connection, but the price was good.

http://tinyurl.com/3lh2ljk

I hope to undo the large inlet pipe modification, perhaps with the one on my “non-standard” radiator and plug up the hole in the bottom with brass sheet.

The present lower pipe seems to be correct or close to correct.

http://tinyurl.com/3nhrkxd

I believe this cooling system was pressurized.

http://tinyurl.com/4y5hd5q

However after removal of this adaption the cap seems usable.

http://tinyurl.com/3ryz9tg

With an extra hole however,

I believe I need to:

1) Find a support channel
2) Return the headlamp tie bar and brackets to their original condition.
3) Replace the lower radiator connection.
4) Fix the radiator cap.


Questions remain the same.

Thanks for putting up with my learning.
JA Benjamin

Jim, to post >1 pic. per thread just post the first one and exit. Then open the thread again and post more on successive comment boxes. It's a pain but it works. Wish I could help on the rad. but I'm not qualified. Others will I'm sure.
Ed
efh Haskell

Jim, when I found my TD (http://www.ttalk.info/Tech/OldFriend.htm) the radiator input and exit ports had been modified to use a Volvo B16B engine. It was much easier to find a stock radiator than to have had the existing one restored. Good luck. Bud
Bud Krueger

You may be absolutly correct Bud.

As I examine my $99 find, I note that the overflow pipe is gone and the hole gas been filled. I will need to recreate this.
Also the mounting studs are short and shot.

I will need to drill the old ones out, thread the holes and install new ones.
They do appear to be 3/8 BSF

If anybody has a pix of the overflow connection I would be appreciative.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

Jim, my radiator (from the53) is sitting next to my bench as we speak. just finished painting it. What area would you like images of? Bud
Bud Krueger

Yes please!
The areas around the overflow and the inlet (lower) connection, and the mounting studs are of paerticular intererest.
If you could include a scale it would help.

I can import the pix into Autosketch and scale things If I have a reference

Thanks.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

Here is a picture of my lower connection. You also might want to extend your fwd carb overflow pipe to below the exhaust manifold.
Mike


Mike Hart (52 TD 16378)

Thanks.
I noted on Daves site he had lowered the overflow pipe. I will make a brass adapter and add some tubing.
JA Benjamin

Jim B.
I found this shot of the radiator support bracket. It is an old modified one that came with the car. I replaced it with one from eBay. This is in the right location but mounted backwards.
Mort


Mort 1950 TD Möbius

Thanks Mort.
JA Benjamin

Important to remember that besides cooling, the radiator and mountings support the radiator shell, bonnet, and wings. All has to be just right for everything to fit properly.
George Butz

Yes George.

Nice that you bring that up. I am working on returning the tie bar back to its original form and I need two dimensions.

(Pleaase see the drawing attached. The yellow boxes are the dimensions I need.)

As I mentioned the original had been lengthened and the "ears" were un-bent.

I intend to remove the added length and weld the two halves together. If sombody can supply the needed dimensions. I will cut the "ears" off and weld them to the correct dimensions.


Thanks


JA Benjamin

Jim, see http://www.ttalk.info/Overflow/ for about 25 images of the overflow. I'll leave the page up until you've gotten what you can use and then I'll take it down. Sorry about the poor tape measure image quality. I tried to get enough to answer your questions. Any more, just ask. I won't be installing the radiator for awhile. Bud


Bud Krueger

Thanks Bud. I have copied all of them.

If I could ask one more thing. Two pictures of the inlet spigot. One head on, one from the side.

I have decided to try and fabricate one. From a Picture on Dave Brauns site it appears to be a rectangle with a round outlet pipe.

I can easially fab the rectangle from sheet brass and then add a round spigot. I just need to estimate the sizes and the angle and the lengt of the pipe.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

Sorry, Jim, but 'inlet spigot' doesn't seem to ring a bell. Bud
Bud Krueger

Sorry;
'inlet spigot'= lower radiator, or radiator inlet connection.
JA Benjamin

Hi all

Just querying whether the top radiator outlet is in the centre of the radiator. If not how much is it offset?

I ask as mine is offset ¬ original, and I am finding it hard to keep the hose of attached to radiator and thermostat housing.

Stuart

Stuart Duncan

Okay, Jim. You mean the outlet at the bottom of the radiator. I'll get that tomorrow. Bud
Bud Krueger

Jim; I have a radiator that is in pieces-not worth rebuilding. If you want bits from it just let me know.Think the lower is in the remnants. Dan Craig
Dan Craig

Thank you Bud.

Stuart;

Mine may have been modified but it seems to be 3/8" to the left
JA Benjamin

Jim,
The two measurement you wanted are 1-1/4" & 13-3/4".

Mind you that I took these with a tape measure in my completed car so I could be of by a fraction.
Mort
Mort 1950 TD Möbius

Jim, see http://www.ttalk.info/Overflow/index.html. Hope I don't get in trouble for pornographic images:
BTW, I can confirm Mort's measurements, but I put the large measurement closer to 13 7/8. (It's the width of the radiator.) Bud


Bud Krueger

Thank ou both.

I have copied the pictures. The dimensions will alow me to fix the cross brace. I will start to draw up the lower radiator connection.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

Jim,
Could I contact you off the BBS with a machinist question. It is off topic (T-series).
You can e-mail me at the address above.
Thanks,
Mort
Mort 1950 TD Möbius

Mort:

email sent.

Jim B.
JA Benjamin

This thread was discussed between 01/10/2011 and 06/10/2011

MG TD TF 1500 index

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