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MG parts spares and accessories are available for MG T Series (TA, MG TB, MG TC, MG TD, MG TF), Magnette, MGA, Twin cam, MGB, MGBGT, MGC, MGC GT, MG Midget, Sprite and other MG models from British car spares company LBCarCo.

MG TD TF 1500 - TD Points of Originality

I'm always interested in learning new things about TD originality, and was intrigued by eBay 350566572271, described as, "As close to perfect as you will find." [That's always a dangerous statement!] I thought the following things were not correct: wrong seat upholstery pattern, dash, tonneau, fuel line, spare tire cover, choke knob, ignition/headlight switch, chrome headlight bars and wind wings, and asked the seller (a dealer) about them on a "perfect" car. His reply was news to me, and I thought I would pass along his information in hopes of getting it confirmed (or, more likely, denied). He wrote:

"At the end of 1952 and the end of the production run of the TD2, the factory offered optional black Haartz tops, and toneaus as this fabric was in stock for the new mgtf. [I thought it was tan cloth throughout the run, and the tonneau was a half-tonneau, not s full one.] Also they ran out of choke knobs for the TD in Dec. 1952 so substituted the knob from other stock available, which was the new MGTF knob. [The knob on that car is not original, or even a TF knob; a TF knob would not have been available until some time later in 1953, I would have thought!] The dash was a factory option that could be ordered thru the
USA MG dealer, as were the wind wings and badge bar [I never saw anything about this in early sales literature]. The ignition switch is 100% correct from NOS. [there are windows on replacement switches, I always thought, and lettering on the original style switch.]"

I can't confirm any of this in the parts list or even any anecdotal info. Any thoughts and help?

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

I was wondering when someone would bring up this 'correct" TD. I don't think you mentioned the optional contrasting fender piping. I didn't know that black hoods and toneaus were an option on TF's either- or round choke nobs.
James
J K Barter

First thing that pops into my little brain after reading that hype:
Check is in your mouth...I won't come in your mailbox.
$50 says the "appraisal" is in the form of "aggreed value" insurance policy.
It's a damned nice car ...but 100 point totaly correct it is not.
(ran out of paint when they did the tank?)
David Sheward

Tom

I am always learning more about our cars but I am with you, those items just don't seem right. I am hoping that someone has an answer.

I am currently restoring a MG TF and it has a black top and came with a new replacement which is also black but I was thinking that this was wrong so I look forward to input.

Brian
Brian Smith (1950 TD3376)

Tom,
Write him again and tell him you're willing to make an offer on the car if he will provide documentation substantiating his claims. Note: an offer doesn't have to meet his reserve so it won't technically be telling a falsehood.
Gene Gillam

Pretty sure black is wrong. Mine is black as is the interior (also wrong except on "one" car from factory).
David Sheward

Can we say BS! The seller has never checked out the New England MG 'T' Register's 'T' Series Handbook. They have a section dealing with the points of originality and non of the things that seller has spewed forth. He talks like the TD production came to an end at the end of 1952 and each point he brings up is pure BS. Cheers - Dave
David DuBois

I this here belt buckle n a rodeo


It's only a cold sore
LaVerne

Nice car, but no $44,000 car. To much chrome (tire rack, headlamp brackets). Black radiator and piping not original. I see that the oil caps on the carbs appear to have been changed.

My pet peeve (even though mine looks like this) is the brass ID plate. If I were judging a car, that would be one of the first things I would deduct for.
Bruce Cunha

"Factory approved Vredestein tires". Hmmm, pretty hard for the factory to approve anything these days! Wrong float lid (they match instead of mirror images), funky and ugly upholstery, chrome on left windscren stantion nuts looks funny (could be lighting), MGA (?)choke knob (not TF which was octagonal), chrome headlamp support bar, etc. Many details wrong. Get the clock fixed. "Brass" factory ID plate-hmm, suppose to be nickel I thought (at least my brass plate is shiny and polished!). Yikes. If they get the money, more power to them. Pity the buyer however! I'm sure the ignition switch was new old stock, but not original on at TD. I have too much time on my hands- David D summed it up well w/ two letters! George
George Butz

Seems pretty unanimous to me.

James - absolutely right on the welting, which I missed.

David - I missed the gas tank photo entirely!

Bruce - How can you tell the oil caps have been changed? Aren't they the correct knurled reound ones? I do think that the radiator slats are painted green, not black. I agree about the ID plate; do you know where to get one nickelled, as original?

Best, Tom
t lange

I just looked....typical used car salesman BS. Wondering whether it had the factory delete for the low fuel warning light or was it the ignition light? Market value is now What$$$$ ????? Guys talking outta both sides of his ass.
LaVerne

Go Tom, GO! Somebody has to set these knuckleheads straight. If it weren't for people like you, a lot more people would be being taken by idiots like this. Thanks for all your hard work.
-David
D. Sander

Dave - Thanks for your supportive comments. I confess I chuckled when the seller wrote back to me toay,
"We have heard from you before with similar points and
honestly we put photos up for buyers to see exactly what this car is. We will let them decide if they like it."

Frankly, people looking critically at his glossy photos are not the people who will be buying this car, but it's advertized towards someone who does not know the details, and wants "The Best."

I truly don't look at details because I am trying to be a PIA, but if someone offers a car as a "Total and correct restoration," "Best you will find anywhere," "Totally restored at a professional European classic restoration shop," and "As close to perfect that you will find ANYWHERE," then I'm going to look at it critically (carefully and in detail), because I want to learn from it. And if it isn't what the seller purports (innocently or intentionally), I can only hope the seller will be as interested to learn what's right and what's wrong, as I am. I am a firm believer in truth in advertizing.

Just last week there was a dealer/broker selling a "Mark II," who didn't know much about the cars, and I was able to show him he had a cleverly and comprehensively faked Mark II (yes, Virginia, there are such things). He was sorry he had been taken for a ride by the seller, but wanted to learn everything he could about the car, in order to straighten out what it was and was not for himself and the next owner. I was happy to speak with him for a long time, and let him know where to look. (See the recent thread, "Ebay TD".)

I study Mark II cars because there is still so much misinformation out there; perhaps I just ought to keep it to myself? The whole point of doing research is to learn, to teach, and to improve. I always try to be polite and helpful, but there will always be someone who knows more than I do. I just hope he really does, and doesn't just THINK he does...


Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

My turn. Perfect car has wrong dip switch, missing piping on front splash pan, straight head screws holding the windscreen brackets to body, an aftermarket engine side cover, wrong and missing hose clamps, a black oil filter housing,(optional?) and the dealer installed hand brake gaiter. That being said - pretty decent ole car. Leave the BS in the bag and let the car stand on its merits. Dan

Tom; Gimme a holler and I'll point you at the guy who helped with my plates.


Dan Craig

Oh yeah - fergot the cobbled up ground cable setup. Silly me
Dan Craig

I think the funniest part of the description is that the price of $44,999 is "well below the market"!!

Don
don scott

Don - I agree; one high sale does not set a precedent for the market.

Tom
t lange

Green carpets? No hidem binding? The 51 "Nut and bolt restoration" is a better car at half the price.

Matthew.
Matthew Magilton

I wonder if there are also windscreen wipers on this $44,900 car ?

Nick, TD3232
Nick Herwegh

Built the same day as 'the53' (TD23618). Bud
Bud Krueger

I get a kick out of it being "one of the last ones" being made... Mine was over 5,000 after this one... I guess that makes mine more valuable?
-David
D. Sander

Unless memory fails me this is the same car that had been lingering on eBay at around $ 34,000 - now it's $ 44,000!

This one won't find a buyer. I've been following the TD market for over a year, since I began looking for a TD for myself. Even after buying mine I've followed it out of habit and interest.

Buyers aren't dropping big coin on any TD's. Even a couple of very nice TC's have barely drawn into the low $ 30,000's.

BobbyG
Bobby Galvez

I'm excited!
$60k is "current market value" on a TD.
Combine that with the old info in Original MGT Series by Clausager (that none of "us" believe) "TF worth 50% more".
Using this guys "logic" I gotta think another "50%" for a 1500 ...right?
So I'm thinking my TF1500 must be "current market value" of around $120K.
Maybe more since I have the rare black interior, hood. tonue cover, and piping!
I'll entertain any offers near that amount. LOL

Does this guy "buy" cars?
David Sheward

Tom

I stand corrected. On my early TD I have octagonal brass carb caps. Are round ones original? I have an extra set of carbs and they also have solid octagonal caps.

Grill does appear to be a very dark green.
Bruce Cunha

Iasked for a little more info on documentation and who did the work.
(Also pointed out a few things I felt were "not correct".)
This is what I got:

"This car was shipped to the UK and restored in the UK by THE foremost TD shop and certified as correct by the MG T Society of England with documentation.
Remember it is one of the LAST cars ever built so different knobs and finishes and fabrics were used for the last few cars as some TF components found their way into late December 1952 built cars.
Best wishes to you.
Please do not contact us again."

I do agree with, at least, the last statement.
David Sheward

"Remember it is one of the LAST cars ever built so different knobs and finishes and fabrics were used for the last few cars as some TF components found their way into late December 1952 built cars."

Ugh! Ignorance is one thing, deception is another. One of the last cars ever built? Not even close. Not only are their NO TF parts on this, the TF was not even conceived of until the end of '53. from concept prototype to production of the TF was only six weeks.
Don't get me wrong, it is a nice car, but the description is full of exaggeration, deception and flat out lies. IMHO the car may be worth $25,000.
It nauseates me to see what people will say/do to make a buck.
-David
D. Sander

I got a rather nastie comment from this moron about my missspelling the word "instrument" ...wished him luck with the auction. Told him I hope he sells it to an attorney.

"THE foremost TD shop and certified as correct by the MG T Society of England with documentation" ...but he can't tall me "who" or "what" documentation?

Go get him Tom! Your our hero for this stuff.
(I'll just end up telling him how I really feel ...I'm not very "P-C" ;-)!

I'm not real smart ...when I google "MG T Society of England" all I get is this pic.
Can somebody tell me what "MG T Society of England" is? I have heard of "BMHT" ...but, who is "THIS" guy?

LOL


David Sheward

Orange Peko ???
LaVerne

Hello TD-TF Group.

This TD appears to have no windshield wipers or
connecting bar....(never driven in the wet...!)

Plus the " Auster " name plate is on the
outside of the windshield...!

Way beyond resonable price, especially for
a seasoned MG fan/owner.

While nice, it's not $45,000 worth of Nice...

There is perhaps more hype & hope that there is fact
& data in the description.


Thank you.


DrRx.


drcrougeux

But...but....but.....

It's "The Best!" The seller said so! ;-)
Rob Edwards

The real tragedy here is that no one buying these "prefict" but over-priced T-type MGs are likely to know of this web-site until well after they've purchased the car.
David Werblow

I'm not quite sure how, but I've had a dozen people in the last year contact me before or after a sale, asking about the car they have just bought or are considiring. I alway try to be honest and straight-forward with them, to make helpful suggestions about things that can be fixed and where to get things rebuilt, and I always encourage them to join the BBS. I cntinue to advise a few of them on making their cars (one a Mark II) as authentic as possible - that's one of the enjoyable things about this MG community.

We'll see where things with this car end up; sarcasm can be a very unattractive trait, especially when people are defensive, as is the seller of this car.

Tom
t lange

Did this thing Sell? I could not tell, maybe looking in the wrong place. It is a nice car as everyone says but 45 big ones, I don't think so....
Tom Maine (TD8105)

So, has anyone else overlooked the 38% increase in value from Feb 2011 ($39,000) to 2012 ($53,900) for their TD? I think I will put all my retirement funds in TD's!!

Don
don scott

Fortunately, this thing did not sell. I just checked, and the auction had ended. I could not resist, I was going to ask the seller where the wipers were on this cream puff. Once the dialouge was opened, I had a few other questions for him.
It is amazing what I have discovered on so called well restored cars. Once you cut through the nice paint jobs, there are often a lot of horror stories burried that then see the light of day. Any perspective buyer should ask who did the restoration on a car, and go over the doccumentation very carefully. There is quite a range in money spent on restorations. The truely well done ones are often quite expensive, more than the car will ever be worth.
I have seen many beautiful (looking) cars fail the NEMGTR "safety Fast" inspection for serious safety issues. I have seen body filler in the frame, missing bolts in the suspension, bare wires in the wiring harness, etc.
Buyer beware...
-David
D. Sander

Did anyone notice that the fuel line between the two carbs is wrong, looks like a rubber hose. Also look and the buffer plates for the bonnet, the rubber top should not be painted, should black rubber.

Don Graig, could you post the email address of the guy who did your nickel work.
Louis


Louis Levin

David

I disagree. The tragedy of this is that E-bay has a system that does not let folks know they are being taken. I understand Caveat emptor, and that the buyer has the responsibility to assure the car is what the seller says it is. But why not have a system that allows valid issues to be brought up?
Bruce Cunha

Guys - the car has been re-listed as eBay 350568535903.

I had some long correspondence with the sellers, and they sent me the following - very reasonable - reply. Notwithstanding the testy reply to some enquiries, they make it clear that they are not car dealers, that they relied totally on the seller's information, and that they will not handle cars in the future. I think this shuld close the matter, as they appear to be doing their best to deal with an owner with unrealizeable expectations?

Tom

"Hi:

Thanks for your response.

We are selling this car for a client, so we relied totally on his description and statements and responses to questions about the car.

He may be a bit daft, we are now thinking, so we had him redo some of the copy keeping your suggestions in mind.

We fully expect that any real buyer would see the car, have it evaluated and then decide if it was the right car for him or her.

We understand you have more expertise than we do, so the auction has been modified, based on your suggestions and we feel the car can speak for itself. In the end, it is what it is, and we cannot hide or change that.

The owner does state that he will listen to any reasonable offer so any buyer can get serious on this car and the owner will listen, he says.

We are not car experts and while obligated to the owner of this car to finish trying to help sell it, we will probably not take on other cars in the future as it is really out of our area of expertise.

We were just trying to help and figured any serious buyer would do his homework.

Again, thanks for alerting us to the potential issues with this auction.

Thanks and good luck to you."

t lange

Just got home from work, opened my email.
Word for word,the samereply Tom got was in my in box.
David Sheward

Maybe the client was had by the previous seller? Glad to see the agent came around. George
George Butz

Nobody has noticed the the overflow lines from the float bowls are all wrong in positioning. Quality correct refinishers would not paint over old rough bopnnet rubbers and the bolt that holds the rear bumper is rusty as if it was never cleaned.
darnoc31

Deduct 1k for every wrong thing this car has and you will get the correct price. The seller is full of bs
Jose Vicente Vargas

To be clear, the OWNER is full of BS, not the seller. The car has been re-listed (eBay 350568535903)with many of the owner's howlers removed, although he STILL claims this is one of the last TD's (even though it was made in Dec. 52 and some 5,000 more were made...).

This is one case where we ought not shoot the messenger, just the message.

Tom Lange
t lange

This thread was discussed between 24/05/2012 and 29/05/2012

MG TD TF 1500 index

This thread is from the archive. The Live MG TD TF 1500 BBS is active now.