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MG TD TF 1500 - TD Press Photo - Caveat Historia

I bought a "RETURN TO LIBRARY" press photo on eBay the other day, with the caption, "The first 1952 MG TD Mark II English auto to arrive here went on display Friday at the Wisconsin Auto Sales Co.... ."

I didn't look at it closely enough on the eBay listing, because the image I got is something quite different - a stock photo, used for a variety of purposes. The car has solid wheels, and is obviously an early 1950 car, too early for any Mark II car, of course. The original photo has been extensively re-drawn with a grey re-touching wash to remove background cars and to strengthen the outlines of door, fenders, people, etc.

Taped to the back of this 8x10 photo are three captions documenting use in whatever paper it was (presumably something in the Chicago/Wisconsin area), the first on Nov. 9, 1951, with a few details of the Mark II. ["The auto's top speed is 96 miles an hour."] Another caption is from 1979, "The MG brought home by GIs after World War II looked much like the 1952 model pictured above." The final one is from 1980, and reads, "The classic 1952 MG: Still a favorite for many car buffs."

Penned along the bottom of the image is "1951 TD series MG - S. H. Arnolt Inc. - Chicago - Distributor."

This note is intended as a warning that you cannot always rely on what you read, especially with the history of MG's. Factory and dealer photographs often show things that are not really in evidence - take the Mark II brochure that shows a car with bucket seats and air scoops on the front brakes, neither of which are found in the production car.

This is a fun picture and going on my garage wall, but is not what I had hoped it was.

Tom Lange
MGT Repair


t lange

96 MPH??? Maybe over the edge of Hoover Damn.....with a tail wind :-)
L E D LaVerne

That's why this is such a let-down - I also wanted to see the 96-MPH TD!

LOL Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

See http://www.bridgeclassiccars.co.uk/product/1951-mgtd-competition-abington-mkii/ for a look at a beautiful historic MKII with provenance. It was recently sold by George Merson, our TD list provider, "My TD sold at Barons Auction in the UK for 28050 pounds." Bud
Bud Krueger

This is still my favorite potential 'alt facts' car.

http://www.mg-cars.org.uk/mgtd/mgtd_monroe_td.htm
Christopher Couper

Bud - are you seriously suggesting that the "beautiful" Mark II you reference is a car worth imitating when doing a restoration? I stopped counting the things wrong when I reached 25.

Some of these errors are perhaps the auction house's mistakes, but surely much of the information came from the owner? For instance, there were actually 16 RHD Mark II cars built in 1951, not 11. Second, I know of 5 that are running around today - this is far from the unique survivor.

But mostly, this is an AWFUL "restoration" (I can barely call it that), unauthentic and just plain wrong on so many counts. Wrong dash color and material, wrong turn signal, wrong place for the VIN plate (and VERY unusual engine stamping), wrong interior, wrong color grille slats, wrong spare tire hubcap emblem, missing (at least) the front Andrex shocks, wrong dash screws, wrong steering wheel color, wrong ignition switch, wrong wiper motor color, wrong parking light lenses, wrong oil filler cap, wrong carbs (!), and I can't immediately verify that it even IS a Mark II car - can anyone tell me the VIN number (I cant read it)? The engine number does not match any Mark II car, even though there is always the possibility that the factory Production Record ledgers are incorrect.

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

Tom, I wasn't talking about the 'restoration' aspect (I hate black upholstery). I just meant the aesthetic bit to grab some $35,000US. At least it had a Mickey Mouse wingnut. Bud
Bud Krueger

Tom, if you open the txt version you can search for Merson and you'll see that the Car No. is 5905 and the Engine number is 6087. Bud
Bud Krueger

I would like to know where I can find a steering wheel cover like that one. I like the designed look.
M Grogan

They sell those steering wheel covers over here on ebay uk.
Bridge Classic Cars - if they can't even get the name of the town of origin right - Abington instead of Abingdon - there is no hope anything else about the car will be right either. Even the grammar is poor.
Dave H
Dave Hill

Bud the car doesn't come up on the T registry as a TD/c which may well explain some of Tom's comments about its authenticity as a true "MK II". It does throw a wrench into the mix but the Registry is known to be inaccurate in some of its data though. But without some other documentation it is suspect. For example a pic of the dumbiron numbers, pics of the suspect detail of the suspension points of the front (missing) Andrex mounts, pics of the rear mounts and Andrex shocks etc. I too find too many details either missing or not shown as further evidence. In looking at the car it would only appear that some items are present as add ons.

I might add that in building TD-4834 I added items to bring it up to some of the TD/c specs even though it is a std TD as I was intending to do some competition with it. All of the TD/Cs pieces were available over the counter from the dealerships when new either as replacements or upgrades.

I'm no expert on TD/Cs by any means but can offer up that my dad's TD/c 8151 does not appear correctly in the registry as well and is shown in the daily production records simply as TD 8151. But assuredly and clearly is a legitimate TD/c. By its known provenance having been originally purchased by my father new from Oxford Motors in Sacramento CA towards the fall of 1951. That doesn't explain the car in questions authenticity but is food for thought

Bill Chasser

TD-4834
TD/c 8151
TD/c 16920
W. A. Chasser

Man.... I am NEVER going to attempt a concourse restoration until you guy are all dead. ;)
MAndrus

MAndrus: My thoughts exactly.
John Quilter

I want there to be no misunderstanding - I think there is a seat for every a**. I have nothing against a Volvo engined TD, a barn find or a concours car.

My problem is when someone describes a car as perfect or magnificent or original, when in actuality it is nothing of the kind. I'm just as happy helping someone get a rustbucket on the road as I am helping someone get the final details right on a 100-pt restoration, never to be driven.

I have these cars:
TA - barn find; rough, Triumph instruments
TB - under restoration - my first car
TC - barn find - last moved in 1976
TC- chassis stored outside for 35 years
TC - disassembled race car
TC - rough car stored since 1976, running perfectly but looking dreadful
TD - 25' car - runs great (I would drive to California)
TD Mark II - too nice for me to own
TD Mark II - barn find (eBay)
TD Mark II - burned out car
TD Mark II - former race car, loosely re-assembled by the seller (eBay) with all SAE bolts...
TD Mark II with chopped fenders; a 50's hotrod - barn find
TF1250; TF1500 - parts car; and my second car
Arnolt - 289 installed, stored for many years.

Get the point - I'm NOT a purist. But I DO believe in truth in marketing. Sell a car as an older cosmetic restoration with a replaced engine, but don't try to tell me that it has original engine or paint, or tires, or upholstery, when it doesn't.

There's a green Mark II TD on eBay right now (not listed as such), that I have told the seller has a replaced engine. Has he mentioned it in the ad? Of course NOT.

I am prepared to put on my originality police uniform - WHEN ASKED, or when being misled!

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

Hello.....my name is Tom...... it's been 3 weeks since I bought my last MG... lol

I agree with the truth in advertising.
L E D LaVerne

Here's a brandy new one, looks like the dealer had the wheels chromed, I'm assuming just for the show. I'll bet it looked real nice. Would have even looked better if they had cleaned the mud off the rear tires! PJ


Paul Jennings

MAndrus,

We are alive and kicking-I think you mean Concours restoration ! (lol).

Cheers
Rob. Grantham
Rob Grantham

Paul, I did not know that TD's could be ridden side-saddle!

And can anyone explain the painted headlight rims please?

Matthew.
M Magilton

Matthew - that was a special Motorama show car, done up with many bells and whistles not found on production cars. Do NOT take it as gospel! There's also a photo of a chassis where literally everything on the engine is chrome plated. Also not to be emulated!

I believe Chris Couver has both these images on his Original MG TD page, for your viewing enjohyment.

Tom Lange
MGT Repair
t lange

This thread was discussed between 26/02/2017 and 28/02/2017

MG TD TF 1500 index

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