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Triumph TR6 - CAMSHAFT
I'm working on a friends car...it needs a camshaft, lifter's etc ..any recommendations on where to get a qaulity one ( we don't want to re-grind this one) ..I'm at the point now of taking the timing chain / gears off ( they will be replaced ).
Everything has ben removed up front 'cept for the hood ..can it be done easy leaving it on ?
Any tips / comments appreciated
|I haven't done it so I am not sure but I don't see why you can't try it and if it doesn't work then you can pull the engine with no real loss of time.|
The concern I would have is being able to pull the camshaft fully out without running out of room at the front valence. A few measurements might confirm that there is clearance.
Prior to pulling the camshaft- remove the rocker arm, push rods and cam lifters. Put them back in the same order so keep track as you pull them out.
Of course, watch the timing when you put it back together. Make sure the timing marks are properly lined up.
Can't help you with where to get one. I would just buy one from the usual suppliers (TRF, VB, Moss, local distributors)
|The TR6 manual from CDII shows the camshaft coming out through the front with the grill and the bonnet removed. There is an excellent list of TR6 cams at www.hottr6.com. |
I just installed a S2 cam from Ted Shumacher www.tsimportedautomotive.com. Talk with Ted about his concerns with some "soft" lifters on the market. He has lifters which have been tested for suitable hardness specs.
Bob - 73 TR6
|The cam can be changed without removing the hood. You may have to jack up the engine (or lower it, I can't remember which) to get the cam through the grill opening, I think. The lifters won't go through the opening in the head, so either the head has to be removed or by removing the pan, the lifters can be pushed up and retained in their bores while the cam is removed, then the old lifters removed and the new ones put in place before the new cam is installed. Needless to say, the dist. and fuel pump also have to be removed first. Not a bad job for 2 people, but kind of a Chinese fire drill for one. Good luck.|
|I haven't done it, but I believe Berry is right - the angle of the engine means the cam will hit the top panel over the grille. If the gearbox is out, you can tilt the engine forwards on the mountings, or alternatively remove the engine mounts and lower the engine slightly.|
I have also heard that a strong (neodymium-iron-boron (NdFeB) magnet on a rod is enough to hold the lifters up while removing the cam.
Handy little suckers!!! but keep them well away from ALL media which could be affected (hard-drives, videotapes, etc)
|You did not indicate other than new what you are looking for in a camshaft. Late last year/early this year if I recall there was a thread discussing different cams and grinds. I was impressed with one of the cams that was available new from British Parts Northwest (BPNW). It was very similar when modeled with one of my warmed over street car favorites, the Reed XS266 grind, but was available new. While I remeber the BPNW connection, I do not remeber which specific brand and model it happened to be, but it is discussed at length in the thread.|
A quick search of the archives should turn up that and other cam related threads.
Like Bob S. says, read CDII. I would be inclined to remove the bonnet as the thing is in the way.
I wounder if one moves away from a stock cam, would it be a good idea to put in bearings with an uprated cam? This means an engine pull.
|Charlie, I replaced the cam when I rebuilt my engine last winter. I also have read on this site that this job can be done without pulling the engine, ie through the front valance. I purchsed a new "mild" cam from British Parts NW, and so far am pleased with performance. For the price of tappets, I would replace them unless they show no sign of wear. Remove old cam and insert new cam very carefully so as not to |
nick" the bearing surfaces of the engine block or the new cam. Ensure before you insert the new cam, that the bearing surfaces are well slathered in engine rebuild lube ( that goes for the tappets as well).
Yes I'm just installing a "stock" cam with new lifters, I have read that the engine mount on the drivers side should be undone and lift the engine to pull out the cam..will have the head and timing parts off on Friday and if all goes well the cam should come out.
I have the grill out but I'd pefer to leave the hood on as they are a pain to re-align.
Thanks for your inputs !
|From what I've read and been told, most of the "street cams" are close to the original design before the engine was detuned to meet the US import emmission requirements. I have "heard" that some people have gone so far as to remove the emmission control pump, cannister and stuff and have enjoyed slightly improved (~10%) performance with a street or road cam. All heresay, of course. Good luck!|
|Yes this one has the extra stuff removed...hopefully it'll run better when #1 exhaust valve works better with a new lobe ! ...basically running on 5 cylinders|
|Here are a few archive locations of prior camshaft discussions:|
From 11 October 2006 "Road Cam" (includes discussion of the BPNW supplied Piper camshaft mentioned above)
From 21 February 2006 "TR6 High Performance Street Cam"
From 9 June 2005 "Engine Rebuild Questions"
From 5 May 2005 "Supercharged TR6 Cam"
From 26 August 2004 "How Much HP and Torque"
As far as the stock TR6 cams go, the lamest of the bunch is the early carb car camshaft, the hottest is the early PI car camshaft. The late carb cars and the late PI cars used the same camshaft. That camshaft was in between the fairly agressive early PI cam and that cast iron rod stock with a smattering of small bumps that was used in the early carb cars. The late stock camshaft is not a bad camshaft and if I were to decide on using a factory "stock spec" camshaft, it is the one I would use.
Regarding camshaft bearings, for the most part it is a judgement call. As long as you are not running the high ratio (1.65:1 type) rocker arms or really high spring seat pressures ( which would eat up the cam anyway) or an extremely agressive cam ( which would be teriible on the street any way), cam bearings would not be necessary unless the block was worn badly.
On the cam follower front, bite the bullet and use new ones. Tossing used followers on a new camshaft is a quick way to write it off. Also use a good assembly and run in lube. For assembly I like the Lubriplate white lithium grease and for run in I like that smelly but effective Crane Super Lube.
|Charlie, is this your first TR6 project? |
I've had mine for just 2 years. FYI - There are several significant "speciality items" that one Must pay attention to. Thrust washers, GL4 Specific tranny fluid, and the reduced ZDDP concerns with the engine oil, just to name a few. If you are aware of these - Great. If not, you should research these items here and at the other TR6 websites. Here is a link to a very good article on engine oils published in our local LBC club's June newsletter, beginning on page 5.
This specifically addresses cam and lifter concerns in our flat tappet engines.
I chiming in to say I bought my stock cam and tappets, as well as other engine rebuild parts, from BPNW. Great guys there and great prices too. I have almost 900 miles on my rebuild and the tappets and push rods are spinning nicely and the valve adjustment has been minimal. I used the ZDDP additive for the 20 minute cam break in on initial engine start.
|HP Henry Patterson|
I just ordered a new vac retard from BPNW and I asked them a couple of questions and they were very helpful.
Just pulled the head off tonight ( man was it stuck on ! ) and tomorrow maybe the timing gears will come off
|Well I pulled the old cam out with no problem...no wonder the car ran lousy..it was basically running on 5 cylinders...the # 1 exhaust lobe is virtually gone and the others are showing wear signs but are about 130 to 133 thou but #1 is 121 thou.|
The picture shows how much is missing..
The new cam and tappets are in transit ..
Thanks again for all your help guys !
This thread was discussed between 12/07/2007 and 17/07/2007
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