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Triumph TR6 - Inventing pointless work?
|Am I just inventing pointless work? |
I finally started on my rear suspension rebuild. I went from new springs to new springs, TA bushes, adjustable TA mounts and shock links. Before I even got the drive shaft out, I decided to remove the rear section of the exhaust to allow me to a)get to the diff flange to remove the drive shaft and b) remove the diff to replace the rubber mounts. The exhaust is old and badly rusted, so I figured I might as well put the Monza system on (I know it will be loud, but it was cheap and will be better than what I have now). I am having trouble getting the pipes split in the middle of the car (at the gearbox mount), so I figured I might as well take off the whole system. I planned to rebuild the carbs over the winter anyway, so I figured I might as well remove the manifolds to clean them up and try to give the echaust manifold some extra life - it looks pretty rusty. Oh dear - that was a lot longer than I thought it would be...
Anyway, my question is am I just inventing stuff to do (shipfitter's disease?) or is this just the way the hobby is? Is there any benefit to removing the manifolds? Will I actually make the exhaust manifold last longer? I must admit that part of me wants to remove the manifolds just because I haven't done it before. That being said, am I biting off more than I can chew as a relative novice with the spanners?
I would value any opinions either way - I just feel like I am going down the road where I will walk into the garage one day to find the car totally disassembled!
Alistair... Go for it. Think what you will learn along the way. It might even help you get the new exhaust system on if you remove the down pipe. I had a &^*%$ of a time replacing my exhaust system. I found it helped to have the trans cover off and seats removed to get the pipes in and connected. My system still rattles against part of the frame once in a while. It's tight in there.
|HP Henry Patterson|
I agree with Henry, go for it.
My car IS completely dissassembled and yes I did learn
a lot during the process. I just hope I can remember
the process during re-assembly....
|Four weeks ago I decided to change my gearbox and overdrive oil.|
A simple afternoon's job.
Since then the complete exhaust system including both manifolds has been removed - PI system and right hand drive, so lots of stuff to remove there.
The intermediate pipes had been installed back to front so were running directly under the o/drive drain plug.
Replaced studs in exhaust manifold (broke while removing), spent a week trying to separate the intermediate pipes from the rear pipes.
Spent another week trying to get the pipes and brackets and new muffler back into place correctly.
Still need to replace the gearbox cover,seats and adjust the PI linkages etc.
This is just the way it is with old cars,one thing inevitably leads to another.
I think as you said it's just the way this hobby is.
So just take your time, and if it becomes a hassle walk away for a while.
|J C Fuller|
|Alistair, there is no such thing as pointless work when your car is your hobby. If you want to do it, go for it. I recently replaced the exhaust manifold on my car for pretty much no reason. I had never removed the carbs before and I wanted to see what the head looked like. I figured, if I'm taking all this old stuff off, I might as well replace it with something new that looks nice. |
Anyways, if it is something you want to do and you think you'll have fun doing it, or either it'll have some sort of benefit for doing it, go for it!
|Alistair, Started the same thing 8 years ago. Hasn't run since.|
|Ah yes, the "while I'm at it" syndrome, know it well. It's just part of the game and can't say that I know anyone that hasn't fallen victim to it.|
As far as the exhaust manifold goes, can't really say that you will give it longer life but you can make it look much better. I blasted mine and gave it good coating of the manifold smuts that Eastwood sells. Due to its cast iron, brittle nature you will need to exercise some level of care when tightening down the outer end flanges (the only ones that are really easy to get at), lest you snap the flange around the bolt hole.
Just remember what was said above, that's one of the nice things about having these as toys, you can always just walk away and come back later
|Thanks for the replies guys - I decided to take the plunge and take off the manifolds. I actually made a start last night - got the carbs off and got all of the manifold nuts loose. Only one of the studs is coming out with the nut - do I need to replace that one? All the studs? All the nuts? Are they "special" nuts?|
Meanwhile, at the back of the car... How on earth do I get the drive shafts off the diff? They are obviously thread locked, and no matter what I try (with hand tools) I can't get the leverage to loosen them. Maybe it's time to buy some impact sockets for the impact wrench that's been gathering dust for the last year?
Thanks again (except perhaps to Don - that's exactly what I am worried about!!)
|On the driveshaft and axle to differential flanges, you really can't get in there with an impact wrench. Hand tools are the way to go, you may just need to get some long 9/16" wrenches to break thee fasteners loose. Once you break them free, then you are left with the tedious task of running them off of those fine threads. |
Use new locking nuts when you reinstall, one of the last things that you want is for those bolts to work loose while you are at speed.
When I took my manifolds off I would say half of the studs came out of the head with the nuts attached. I thought it was best to replace both studs and nuts. The studs with the nuts fused to them probably wouldn't torque up properly if reused. I couldn't find replacement studs locally. I think they are fine thread metric. I had to order them. I think I got them from British Parts Northwest. You don't need to replace the little football shaped clamps. reusing those is fine. It's pretty cheap to replace all the studs and nuts and it looks nicer.
|HP Henry Patterson|
|Henry, The nuts that came with the car are actually speced Brass.|
|The manifold studs are not metric, but they are unusual relative to the majority of stuff that you would find in a typical harware store. Most studs that you see there and even in many industrial supply catalogs are fine thread on one side and coarse thread on the other, the manifold studs, the trailing arm studs, the rocker studs, etc are fine thread on both sides. With a few exceptions, the fasteners used on these cars are a Unified fine thread (UNF) which was designed to be interchangable with the SAE fine thread used over here, think lend-lease program and all of the US built stuff used by the Brits in the 40s. Hence the need for a "unified" thread standard.|
The spec'ed nuts are indeed brass, and it never hurts to use a good anti-seize compound on exhast system fasteners, you'll be glad you did the next time you have to pull that thing off and trust me, there will be a next time if you keep the car any length of time.
|Alot of the engine builders are using a socket head style bolt to install the manifolds. Not as good of leverage but alot easier to install.|
I started one weekend to change the fuel filter, ended up rerouting the fuel lines, installing new braided hoses, a new filter etc etc etc...took 2 weekends for a five minute job!
get used to it, ithats half the fun..inventing a reason to work on her
|And I thought this was going to be about a pointless ignition...|
Since you seem to have the car laid up for the winter, do all you can afford. Soon it will be driving weather again.
Have fun, you'll soon be bragging to your buddies about the travails of LBC restoration. Enjoy the little victories, they start to add up to a great car you can be proud of.
|Thanks for the encouragement guys. I just finished getting the exhaust and manifolds out (complicated by the PO welding some sections of exhaust together...), and I have a couple of questions...|
On the inlet manifold, the water pipe seems to be rusted quite badly in places - a quick wire wheel lead to some pinholes appearing, so I guess it was on borrowed time. It looks like I can't remove that pipe. Can I just clamp a piece of pipe under the old one and bypass it?
Several manifold studs came out with the nuts, but a few remain. I plan to replace them all, but a trial run using two nuts to remove one of the studs just stripped the thread off the stud where my two new nuts were. Is there a better way?
Thanks in advance for your help!
|Soak the living twiddle out of them .Heat and soak. It will come.|
I hear Kroil penetrating oil is great. I have never used it but people say it really does free up "frozen" fasteners.
Also there has been some previous discussion about bypassing the manifold tube. It sounds as though its done quite a bit.
|HP Henry Patterson|
|PB Blaster works very well|
This thread was discussed between 16/11/2006 and 20/11/2006
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