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Triumph TR6 - Oil cautions

To all with new or about to be new engines.

http://www.capecodbritishcarclub.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=839
DON KELLY

UMMMMM...thanks Don. You are a year late for the break in but no feer...I use Castrol 20W-50 GTX.

VERY intersting to say the least.

It appears that the minimum ZDDP (zinc dialkyldithiophosphate)is.11%
At the bottom of the post Don has linked us to, is a link to another article and I copy from it the list of oils and their ZDDP content.

20W-50
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Exxon High Performance .11
Havoline Formula 3 none
Kendall GT-1 .16
Pennzoil GT Perf. none
Quaker State Dlx. none
Red Line none
Shell Truck Guard .15
Spectro Golden 4 .15
Spectro Golden M.G. .13
Unocal .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Race .20
Valvoline Synthetic .12

20W-40
AMSOIL none
Castrol Multi-Grade .12
Quaker State none

15W-50
Chevron .11
Mobil 1 none
Mystic JT8 .15
Red Line none

5W-50
Castrol Syntec .10
Quaker State Synquest none
Pennzoil Performax none

5W-40
Havoline none

15W-40
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol .14
Chevron Delo 400 none
Exxon XD3 .14
Exxon XD3 Extra .13
Kendall GT-1 .16
Mystic JT8 .15
Red Line none
Shell Rotella w/XLA .13
Valvoline All Fleet .15
Valvoline Turbo .13

10W-30
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Chevron Supreme .11
Exxon Superflo Hi Perf 135 .11
Exxon Superflo Supreme 133 .13
Havoline Formula 3 none
Kendall GT-1 .16
Mobil 1 none
Pennzoil PLZ Turbo none
Quaker State none
Red Line none
Shell Fire and Ice .12
Shell Super 2000 .13
Shell Truck Guard .15
Spectro Golden M.G. none
Unocal Super .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Race .20
Valvoline Synthetic .12

5W-30
AMSOIL (old) none
AMSOIL (new) none
Castrol GTX .12
Chevron Supreme .11
Chevron Supreme Synt. .12
Exxon Superflow HP .11
Havoline Formula 3 none
Mobil 1 none
Mystic JT8 .1
Quaker State none
Red Line none
Shell Fire and Ice .12
Unocal .12
Valvoline All Climate .11
Valvoline Turbo .13
Valvoline Synthetic .12

-scott noteboom
Rick Crawford

Yes I was told to get the Rotella by the gallon for diesels or use racing oil or add STP to my oil.
Steve Hazelfeldt

Rick- From another forum

"Just a few months ago I heard about some fuel that had been developed from water and presentations had been made favorably to the US Congress. Now I hear the "perfect" Castrol GTX 20-50 oil is aggressively wearing out my camshaft all because the "sneaky" regulations required the removal of zinc from the oil. Because of the shortage of zinc in the oil, suitable and recommended oil for diesel engines should be used in my TR6!

Shortly after these announcements life goes on as if nothing has happened. Now you guys that had the camshaft ware out so quickly may know the real reason for the failure and it may have had nothing to do with the way it was manufactured.

Where is my water turned to fuel, and where is the zinc.

I am mad as heck and I want take it any more! "
DON KELLY


2 years later my engine/cam still going strong. I used an assembly lube with moly all over the cam for breakin. I think I used an oil additive. I did my initial start with 20W-50 GTX and have run the same oil ever since. "knock on wood"

HP Henry Patterson

Most engine builders don't recommend Castrol as a break in oil.
DON KELLY

Don:

Thanks for the tip. I've got a lot of $$ sunk into the engine rebuild and would be really ticked to ruin the expensive Goodparts GP2 cam by running "improved" oil during break-in. I'll be doing a lot more research before final assembly and consider additives on a long term basis. Looks like a good chapter for CDIII. Keep up the good work!

Cheers,
Bob
1976 - TR6
Bob Evans

Bob- Really can't take to much credit. I just steal it from elsewhere and share it with you all.
DON KELLY

I don't know how easy it is to get over there, but Penrite is highly recommended by many Classic Car owners.

These guys are listed on the Penrite website as the US Agents.

Restoration Supply Company
15182B Higland Road
Escondido
CA 92025
California
USA



http://www.penrite.com.au/html/s02_article/article_view.asp?id=387&nav_cat_id=158&nav_top_id=55&dsb=580

Click the Running In Oil link on the page above - it lists the zinc and phosphorous concentrations.

Roger H

Don
In the persons justified rant he says castrol GTX 20-50 (20W-50)has no ZDDP in it. According to my list above, Castrol GTX 20W-50 has .12% ZDDP in it. I thought I saw said that GTX 20W50 had no ZDDP. ...but it was that the diesel oil version was going to have the ZDDP removed from it.
Could very well be not recommended as break in oil.

I sent an e-mail to the manufacturer of the assembly lube used in my engine rebuild. ( LUBRIPLATE No. 105 Motor Assembly Grease) available at most auto supply.
Here is his response:
"Dear Mr. Crawford:

LUBRIPLATE No. 105 Motor Assembly Grease contains zinc-oxide. Zinc-oxide imparts a very effective anti-wear coating on all of the moving parts of the engine. It is one of the three primary reasons why No. 105 Motor Assembly Grease is so effective in engine rebuilding and remains effective at initial start-up and when the engine is at full capacity.
ZDDP is the chemical name for fluid zinc which is an anti-wear compound for fluid lubricants.

Thank you for your inquiry. "

I tend to agree with you poster from your other threads Don. Maybe this is the mystery behind early cam shaft failure or early wear.


Yes definitely will be added to CDII Bob. As a big WARNING!

Rick
Rick Crawford

Guys,

To you Redline users, according to the Redline website and the MSDS sheets for their oils, they contain 0.12% zinc. I nearly had a panic attack since I use Redline 10W40!!!

Mike
'73 TR6
Mike Calhoun

Mike
I think there is a few guys out there doing a quick web search....including myself.
Rick
Rick Crawford


Rick,

Are you convinced yet that our 20W-50 GTX is .12%? Do you know if it has alway's been .12%. Maybe we need to locate some zinc additive just to be sure. Can't have too much..right?

Henry

HP Henry Patterson

Henry
Have no idea if too much is TOO much. It is said that .1% is sufficient. Not a chemist.

I will send an e-mail to Castrol and ask the question if they in fact do have .12% content ZDDP. Will post the answer.
Rick
Rick Crawford

I have just sent an e-mail to Castrol USA and asked specifically if GTX 20W-50 has ZDDP in it or not.
I have gone over to the MG site and here is the link to this whole discussion:

http://www2.mgcars.org.uk/cgi-bin/gen5?runprog=mgbbs&mode=thread&access=&subject=8&source=T&thread=200610090226352026

After reading the MG thread it appears that Castrol has already been contacted and the answer is:
.075% (GTX products) and > .1% (GTX products)
So it depends who you ask at CASTROL???????

STP gets added to spring oil change! Not sure if it will go with CASTROL GTX 20W-50 or not.
Rick C
Rick Crawford

Just a note of thanks to all contributors here. Another good example of how BBS guys help each other.

Rick... when my thread some time ago was asking about oil (synthetic v non synthetic) you mentioned that I should go with the engine rebuilder's recommendation. It's been a month or two and still no answer from him. He's either too busy, doesn't care or he's hiding something. With this recent thread I've asked about zinc & assembly lube. I think my guy doing the resto is equally frustrated with the mechanic's communication skills. Will post if I get a decent reply... someday.

Ken.
K. T. Shaddock

When I broke in my engine (about 5,000 miles ago) i liberally smeared the cam shaft with a moly lube and then poured STP down the pushrod galleys. I used Castrol 20w50 for the break-in oil. Changed oil at 1000 miles again using Castrol 20w50. At 3000 miles I converted to 15w50 mobil 1. All this discussion has me concerned as to whether I should be using the synthetic or convert to Rotella. All valve train parts and cam were new. Had the head off a while back and checked the tappets-very smooth with no discernable wear or any kind of scoring. Anybody with an opinion or adversw experience on the Mobil synthetic?
Mike Crane '71 TR6 PI cam, triple ZS, roller rockers
mike crane

Does anyone know if oil gets too old?
If I buy enough zinc additive oil for say 10 oil changes or 10 years, will that stuff be still good for the last oil change?
Chris
Christopher Trace

This all makes me feel a little better about my "investment" in Redline oils several years ago.
Brent B

Chris
Here is your answer.
go to the following URL and go down to "Engine Oil Shelf Life" http://www.carbibles.com/engineoil_bible.html

In a nut shell, yes engine oils have a shelf life.

This is a good article and Chris says NOT to use oils designed for deisel engines in petrol engines.
Rick C
Rick Crawford

Just got my reply from Castrol Here it is.
(I did not even mention cam failures in my question)



"Castrol is aware of articles in enthusiast magazines and web-sites, as
well as after-market parts manufacturer discussions concerning GF-4
engine oils and cam-shaft durability issues in older performance
vehicles. Some consumers suspect the lower level of ZDDP in GF-4 oils
may be causing these failures. Castrol is currently investigating this
issue.

For those consumers that wish not to use a GF-4 oil in these vehicles,
Castrol does offer the following products that contain Zinc at a level
that is higher than the Zinc level found in oils (API SG) marketed
during the "muscle car" era of time:
* Castrol GTX 20W-50 (SL,SM)
* Castrol GTX Diesel 15W-40 (CI4,CH4,CG4,CF4,CF,SL)
* Castrol GTX High Mileage 20W-50 (SL,SM)
* Castrol HD 30 (SL,SM)
* Castrol HD 40 (SL,SM)
* Castrol Syntec Blend Truck 15W-40
(CI4,CH4,CG4,CF4,CF,SL)(Semi-synthetic)
* Castrol Tection Extra 15W-40 (CI4Plus, CI4,CH4,CG4,CF4,SL)
* Castrol Hypuron S 15W-40 (CI4Plus,CH4,CG4,SL)(Semi-synthetic)

The following Castrol products have Zinc levels that are typical of API
SG oil:
* Castrol Syntec 5W-40 (SL,CF)(Synthetic)
* Castrol GO! 10W-40 Motorcycle Oil (SG)
* Castrol GO! 20W-50 Motorcycle Oil (SG)
* Castrol Grand Prix 4-Stroke Motorcycle Oil 10W-40 (SG)
* Castrol Grand Prix 4-Stroke Motorcycle Oil 20W-50 (SG)
* Castrol TWS Motorsport 10W-60 (SJ)(Synthetic)

If installing a new performance cam in an older performance vehicle, it
is important to:
* follow the installation recommendations provided by the cam
manufacturer
* use the recommended cam break-in lube
* prime the engine oil circuits
* use the recommended engine oil
* confirm valvetrain geometries prior to starting the engine with
the new cam

Castrol Consumer Relations"
Rick Crawford

Well this is getting interesting.
My second e-mail to Castrol asked specifically to give me a percentage. The Reply was .75%.
NOTICE in their first reply above the comment about it being even higher than the muscle car era. My third request for clarification I stated I have also seen from Castrol customer relations that it was .075%
They replied "Our apologies, the correct percentage is .075%. We regret the typographical error."

So in fact the ZDDP level in Castrol GTX 20W-50 has gone down almost 50% in the past year or two. I am not sure exactly when.

BOTTOM LINE:
As far as I am concerned, Castrol is still a good oil product. The next oil change (in the spring) will be GTX20W-50 and a can of STP. (My next e-mail is to STP just to make sure they are not doing any funny business).

I will not be going the route of diesel oil. It is not formulated for gas spark plug engines.

Rick
Rick Crawford

Guys:

Interesting note included with the GP2 road cam which arrived from Richard Good at Goodparts. He recommends after rebuilding the engine with a new GP2 cam to run it at 2000 rpm for 20 minutes, shut it down and change the oil. Along with other considerations, this could be a further wise precaution against premature cam wear prompted by shortcomings in the current oils??? Anyway, he makes the cam so I'm going to follow his advice.

Cheers,
Bob
1976 - TR6
Bob Evans

That is the instructions that should be followed on any new engine.
DON KELLY

Bob
Keep in mind your very first line of defence is a good assembly lube that contains a good dose of Zinc.
RIck
Rick Crawford


Rick,

Good investigative work!

I'm going to continue use 20W-50 GTX as well. Please let me know what you find out about STP. I'll add that too if it makes sense.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Henry et al
The reply from LUCAS is basically toss the crap in the garbage. Here it is:
QUOTE "Rick,
Thanks for looking to Lucas for solutions. Lucas Oil Stabilizer does not
contain ZDDP but it does contain a very effective anti-wear additive package
that is good enough to be recommended by cam manufacturers as an assembly
lube for flat tappet applications. ZDDP has been virtually eliminated by
government decree. We do have it included in a specialized product, Lucas
High Performance Assembly Lube part # 10153.
Thanks again,
John Mingus "

NOTE: Maybe I should ask him the names of the CAM manufacturers and what the "package" is.

One down one to go....

STP...well it looks like they have school children answering their e-mails. My grandson could have composed a reply with better grammar.
I QUOTE"Reference Number: 4750939

Dear Mr. Crawford,

Thank you for contacting us about STP Oil Treatment. We always appreciate hearing from our consumers.

Unfortunately, the percentage of ZDDP in the both the STP Oil Treatment and the STP Oil Stabilizer is proprietary. What I can tell you is that the STP Oil Treatment contains 4 times the amount of ZDDP than what the oils use to contain and the STP Oil Stabilizer contains 6 times the amount. The stabilizer has the higher percentage and is based in a 10w30 weight oil. I hope this information helps you.

Again, thank you for contacting us.
Sincerely,

Patti Copper
Consumer Response Representative
Consumer Services " end of quote from cut and paste to this BBS thread.

I plan on contacting STP again and hopefully I will talk to an adult.

The underlying words in the replies from CASTROL and LUCAS are that they are VERY aware of the problem with the reduction of ZDDP in engine oils. In both cases I did not say anything about premature cam failure. What I posted above (my first post) I do not trust at all. A year ago maybe but not today. I do not think there is any oil formulated for an internal combustion engine that contains > .1% ZDDP available today.
PLEASE prove me wrong.
Rick
Rick Crawford


Rick,

It sounds as though using STP would boost the amount of ZDDP when added to our present 20W-50 GTX. We just won't know by how much. It might be a good stop-gap measure until we find out what's what. Maybe even permanent.

Thanks for the info.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Rick, et.al.
I'm totally confused. I hope all y'all get this figured out before I get to my engine work in a few months.
db
Doug Baker


Yeah Doug I'm with you now. After reading more about additves such as STP I'm less inclined to use that as a "fix". Also there are many conflicting stories out there on the net (no surprize) about ZDDP levels. For instance, the web site that is accessed from this original thread, that Don posted, mentions that Castrol HD 30 has the highest concentration of ZDDP and moly of all the Castrol products. However, according to the list above, Castrol HD 30 has the same (SL,SM) rating as GTX 20W-50. Maybe I don't understand the ratings.

Maybe I'll look at additves supplied by cam companies and run with that for a little while until I get about 3000 miles. I'm only at about 600 miles on my rebuild. I did use a good cam assembly lube and performed the 20 minute inital start break in procedure.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson


I was just at the local auto parts mega store looking over all of the oil additives. There are a bunch. The only additive that even mentions ZDDP is STP. It's in very small print on the front of the bottle. It's states something like *ZDDP additive. It doesn't indicate any other ingredients. I have read that many of the additive use teflon and that it can cause problems with oil filters. STP has been around for a long time so maybe it's okay...I don't know...still confused.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson


I checked Crane Cam's web site and found they have an oil additive with what the say is a high concentration of ZDDP to be added to the engine oil for the break-in period. It comes in an 8 oz. bottle. I couldn't find a price at their site so I'll call them tomorrow and post the price and any other info I find out about their additive.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

That would be the Crane Super Lube. Typical selling price is in $9 to $10 range these days. I have used that stuff off and on for more than 30 years now. Whatever you do, don't spill any of it on your clothes or spill it all over the floor. I had a bottle of that stuff fall off the shelf and start leaking several years ago and it took weeks before the smell was gone from the shop and you just can't wash that smell out of your clothes.
SteveP

Henry
Here is another WEB site that could "add" to the confusion.
http://www.mail-archive.com/oldsmobile@chebucto.ns.ca/msg07551.html

This WEB site does have a very good suggestion at the beginning.
This problem is very new as I think this all started in the last couple( maximum) of years that legislation forced the reduction of ZDDP in motor oils. So you get WEB sites that have information from suposedly experts from the manufacturers saying their product still has high levels. we have seen 2 different people from the same comapny (Castrol) say 2 different things about specifically GTX 20W-50. I myself even had 2 different numbers given to me.... .075% and .75%. They appologized for the "typographic error". With such a controversial subject and a potential loss of customers, I think you would be more careful in replying to e-mails that will be told to many owners of cars this affects.
In the past oil companies ahve said that you should not add any "snake oil" to their oils. They where quick to say that but they sure have not been quick to say our oils just ain't doin' the full job anymore.
Rick
Rick Crawford


You're right Steve. It's their Super Lube Concentrate oil additve loaded with ZDDP.

I called the Crane Cam tech line and talked to a person who was well versed on this ZDDP issue. Interestingly, for engine/cam break-in you don't need to use the Super Lube. He said they tell people to use Shell Rotella which is a crude based diesel oil. The diesel oils did not have to comply with the regulations regarding ZDDP. We now know that of course. The Shell Rotella, he said, would be used for the cam break-in peroid only. He said after initial break-in you can switch back to regular gas engine oils regardless of their ZDDP levels. I forgot to ask him how long they define the break-in period. But I did tell him that I have 600 miles on my rebuild and he said it's well broken in as far as the cam goes. He said I would have had the problem very early on if the lube to the cam was insuffient at initial break-in. In fact I have adjusted my valve clearance twice since my rebuild and there was hardly any adjustment necessary.

Rick, I think you did your rebuild around the same time I did. It was a couple of years ago for me. The 20W-50 may have had more ZDDP in it then which may have helped our break-in. I know the cam assembly lube I used was heavily loaded with ZDDP.

So, if we go by Crane Cam recomendations then we don't need to worry about the oil we run if we are past the cam break-in period and all is well.

Probably not the end of the story.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Henry
My investigation into this government controled world has led me to the discovery that this issue goes back to earlier than 2004. The oil companies are VERY aware of it and are doing nothing only because WE are a very small minority of oil purchasers. They forgot we also have "daily drivers".
We all need to go to my last post above (the 18th) send Castrol a letter asking them to come up with a product that retains high levels of ZDDP or we will stop using their products in our daily drivers.
Rick
Rick Crawford


Right!

I think a company would do well if they came out with an oil at different viscosities for classic cars or vehicles without catalytic convertors. It could be clearly stated on the label.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Rick and all,
what is so different about todays cams that they don't need the same protection from ZDDP that our old cams (or new old cams)do?
Otherwise why arern't their cams failing?
I would love to hear what ALL others have to say about this subject.
Thanks,
Chris
Christopher Trace

Rick,
I'm chiming in a bit with Chris here....After talking with a master tech (remember when we called 'em mechanics?) at work, his question was why doesn't this affect new Honda Motor Co cams? (Acura) The cam followers have a flat face that rides on the lobe... So what's up with that?
Rod
Rod Nichols


Just a guess here but I've seen some newer production cam setups where the valve stem is in a bucket type of lifter which has a much larger diameter and spins much easier when the cam lobe provides the lift compared to our old solid lifter in a bore. So maybe there isn't as much friction. Some other designs use rollers on the lifter. Engineers these day's are doing everything they can to reduce internal engine friction to help fuel economy.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson


Also, as I have been told, the lack of ZDDP is only an issue when breaking in a new cam. The break-in is a 20 minute run-in at about 2000 RPM when the engine is first started with a new cam. The cam lube that is used to assemble the new cam is loaded with ZDDP. Also, as noted above, Crane Cam's requires the use of oils with ZDDP for that initial break-in. If the oil is not available they have an additive for your oil that is loaded with ZDDP. I'll bet other cam manufacterers have the same requirement So, manufactures are probably doing the same type of break-in for the cam when they initially run their engines before going into the vehicle. Older engines are probably more prone to have problems if the break-in is not followed as opposed to newer engines that may be more robust and able to survive an improper break-in.

This is just the way I have interpreted all this info and since my cam is all broken in with no problems I'm not going to worry about the ZDDP level in the oil.

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Chris and Rod
In my surfing on this subject I have seen absolutely zero talk about any modern engine having this problem. It has all been older cars in our vintage.
I am no engine guy but maybe Henry has a point.

The ONLY reason ZDDP is/has being taken out of engine oils is to "save" the catalytic converters from having premature failure. Tree hugers do not care that it might be harmfull to a few engines.

Maybe it is too soon to tell how the removal is affecting NEW engines.

You chaps need to go and read the entire thread at the MG site. There are definitely sceptics there also. How big a problem this is I do not know. All I know is that it all talks about my baby. I want to know about everything that "COULD" be harmful to her health...period.
Rick
Rick Crawford

Fellow enthusiasts

So far I have found the following that contains ZDDP.

Valvoline VR1 20W-50 racing motor oil (NAPA)
STP oil treatment
STP oil stabilizer
NOTE: of the 2 STP products the Stabilizer is the only one that actually says ZDDP on their WEB site.
General Motors EOS.
I have read that you do not use a full container on an oil change. 1/4 to 4 quarts of oil. Will ask GM the question.
As of Today, SHELL Rotella T. BUT as of January 2007 Shell will reduce or remove ZDDP from all diesel oil products.
I do not think using Diesel oil in a gas engine is such a good idea anyway. (IMHO)
Rick
Rick Crawford


Rick,

The STP oil treatment does indicate ZDDP on the front of the bottle. It's in very small print and does not give any amount figure.

I ran across that GM EOS stuff but didn't find out anything other than it has ZDDP.

I'm leary of any additive but if one of them has mostly ZDDP and NO other things like Teflon then I might use it.

Merry Christmas

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Henry
I looked at a bottle of STP Oil treatment at a local store and it did not mention ZDDP. I do not think we can get the oil stabilizer up in Canada, but on their WEB site it definitely has the letters ZDDP on the bottle of oil STABILIZER. The oil TREATMENT does not.

I am tending to lean towards the GM EOS.

The GM stuff I do not think is much different that the STP oil treatment. GM was just not stupid and advertise it to keep your engine running even after you drain the oil. It is a fact that ZDDP is good for engines. Again, it was only removed because it "eats" catalytic converters.
Rick
Rick Crawford


That's funny...maybe STP took the ZDDP out recently. I was at Murray's auto parts and they had both the treatment and stabilizer. I looked at both bottles, side by side, and each referenced ZDDP. Strange! I guess I'll double check next time I'm there. Who knows maybe I'm affected by CRAFT's disease (you remember..Can't Remember a F$#@&&8 Thing)

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Henry
No fear lad . You do not have CRAFT (at least on this issue:)
Because we are a bi-lingual country, all labeling must be in both English and French. Maybe there was just not enough room for those 4 letters. I am sure what is inside is identical. Thanks for correcting me.
Rick
Rick Crawford


Ah yes bi-lingual. I forgot about that. When I drive in Canada I think it's funny that some of the bilingual road signs seem a tad unnecessary. Such as North/Nord. That's a tough one to figure out. If I spoke French would I get lost if only North was printed? Or vice-versa?

Merry Cristmas all

Henry
HP Henry Patterson

Just talked with a GM dealership up here in Canada so in US will be a little less.
500ML (17.6 oz.) E.O.S. ( engine oil supplement) taxes in= $9.50. Use 4 ounces at oil change...so 4 years use equals $2.34/year.(based on 6 cylinder car).

Pair that up with CASTROL GTX 20W-50 and Bob is still your uncle.
Rick

PS more reading for you.
http://www.hotrod.com/techarticles/engine/flat_tappet_cam_tech/index.html

Rick Crawford

According to Kai Radicke at Wishbone Classics, even the ZDDP-rich diesel oils are due for a reduction/phaseout by the end of the decade. This is disappointing for those of us who keep Chevron Delo or Shell Rotella in their classic engines for the ZDDP advantage.
Rick Orthen

Rick
It has happen sooner than you think. All Diesel oils will phase out /reduce ZDDP in its oil effective beginning of 2007...like now. I think diesel oil will be down to auto oil ZDP levels within 2 years if not immediately.
Diesel oil follows an API spec also. Pre 2007 it was API CI-4 and then CI-4 PLUS (just a industry wide attempt to have one standard). Then In 2006 with lauch for beginning of 2007 was is CJ-4 This spec is aimed at 2007 diesel vehicles that MUST have EGR valves installed.
I have done considerable reading on this and did not see specific numbers for either CI-4 or CJ-4 ZDDP levels. It did say that zinc and phosphorius are reduced in CJ-4 spec. CJ-4 is backwards compatable but CI-4 is not forward compatable with 2007 diesel vehicles. Ok so what does this mean with us TR6 owners. Well buy up all the API CI-4 diesel oil you can find. MAKE SURE IT IS STAMPED CI-4 SPEC.
The good news ( well sort of:) is that CI-4 oil spec will be avaialble for some time but as one company says only in 50 Gal. drums!

Mr GM dealership...here I come:)
Rick
Rick Crawford

This thread was discussed between 07/12/2006 and 31/01/2007

Triumph TR6 index

This thread is from the archive. The Live Triumph TR6 BBS is active now.