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Triumph TR6 - Price of Wire Harness
Does anyone have a answer or reason to this small mystery.
I am not out to bash any company but I do wonder about this with hope to hear why.
There is a gap in prices between a few wire harness suppliers that doesn't make sense.
"Advance Auto Wire" has what looks like a superior product, and they know LBCs. Their product is $370.00 USd. It's a 8 fuse system. 8 seems to be enough for our cars right?
Then you have a company called "Hot Rod Wires" who has a heavy duty 12 (4 extrathen AAW)fuse system and is what the industry calls a "painless install" kit. Basically an all purpose bumper to bumper harness for any car restoration project. They want $179.00 USd
May I have a comment back. If you were the one who was shopping for a harness?
I have had a few questions for both firms and answers only from "Hot Rod Wire" (over the weekend believe it or not) and no one from "Advance Auto Wire" has responded to my tech questions.
How about http://www.britishwiring.com/
Or, I bought mine through The Roadster Factory, or if you are looking to upgrade, how about Dan Masters? I might be wrong, but I believe the one I bought from TRF might be a British Wiring harness anyway. I would shop these guys....but $350 to $400 sounds like it's in the ballpark!
|I would want my wires to color-match the diagram for the car, if nothing else.|
So it sounds like the dash is coming out soon???
Rod NOTE: Advance Auto Wire is Dan Masters.
Dan,s wire harness DOES match OE colour code.
His harness can be "custom tailered" to your vehicle.
It comes with very good instructions that are specific to a TR6 (not generic).
Hot Rod wire, quite a lot less money. Will do the same job as AAW kit. 12 fused circuits is over kill. Will not be to OE colour code but not really a problem as it will come with a schematic and that is all that is needed for trouble shooting. Besides, both kits will be wrapped in electrical tape. IMHO, the only MAJOR difference between the 2 is price.
Both kits are open wire length and everything has to be cut to length and terminated.
Just went to BW web site and I am impressed. Marcello, would definitely get them to quote. Might be less expensive in the end as all sockets and termination points are OE match and can be bought from them as needed. Definitely worth a look!
All wires look OE colour and are correctly terminated. This is BIG!. Installation would be, at least, half the time to do it. THIS is true painless!
Only big downfall is you are stuck with original amount of fused circuits. Only a problem if you plan to add 10,000 Watts of amplifier and 1,000,000 candle power driving lights.
|Marcello - Get a quote from Rhode Island wiring as well. They have them original or ask about changes.|
DonElliott, 1958 TR3A, Montreal
Rhode Island was more into keeping a car "original" in it's wire state. Not for me, I want some thing that will be better if not a upgrade, I do not have a desire to drive with a fire extinguisher. They told me they can rebuild a harness to match the original TR spec, the original TR6 spec was not a great thought.
Yes the dash will need to come out now for sure. It will start at the end of my drive season say November. (please come by for a hot beverage) I will give BW a look. I am also watching a few kits on Ebay. Bottom line is that I don't need 12 fuses but nice to have at least 9 or 10. I am saddened to hear that AAW is so expensive and they are not answering my emails. I think Dan Masters is better person then that. Yes all kits come marked and coded now anyway as for colour match how hard is that to do while you are installing?....not at all.
I will make my decision by no later then next week. Again just surprised in the huge rate difference.
Advance Auto wants = $370.0
Centech Wire = no answer yet
British Wire = no answer yet
Ron Francis wants = $345.95
Most extensive and thorough company.
Hot Rot Wire wants = $179.00
Also very thorough and extensive and most affordable
Rhode Island wire wants = Not for me
Moss Motors wants = $399.95
|Marcello, Installing a wiring harness is a big job which you only want to do once and hopefully not have to deal with again. I would not make price the main factor in purchase of a harness. In your first post you say that two harnesses will do the same job but later want something that is an upgrade if not better than the origional. Be careful, this may be a case of getting what you pay for, in both quality and ease of installation. A wiring harness is not an item to skimp on. I insalled a new harness in a british car last winter, big job that I only want to do once, it eliminated alot of problems and once finished provided much peace of mind. |
the other thing you pay for in a wire harness is someone else doing the work for you.
Meaning, someone cutting the OE colour coded wire to correct length for every termination point and then SOLDERING the correct terminal/connector.
This WILL cut installation time in half and truly make it "painless".
With this said I do not beleive AAW is NOT to length and terminated.
BW and riwire ARE to length and terminated.
Also, Maybee Dan is on holidays.
I feel you misunderstood.
I will re-explain. a "upgrade" refers to a comparison to the original Lucas system. Dental floss would be a upgrade.
As far as 2 systems being the same, they are! It really comes down to price, I am sorry if you disagree but wire gauge is the same and jacket is the same, length is the same box is the same and so forth. So what would you say is the factor other then price.
Lastly about "the Big Job" I am not afraid of turning a wrench nor am I shy to hard work. If I was, I would have purchased a Japanese car and not a Brit car. But for this I won't be doing it, I will be watching, learning and assisting a buddy who does this full time. He is paying me up on a old favour.
Half the fun is the cutting and being in a heated garage drinking hot coffee and form fitting everything from scratch. Once again, BW won't even provide a rate and Rhode Island Wire only makes replicas of the original for concourse show cars (dental floss theory)
I would like to think and hope DM is on holidays, I am also to assume he is a one man show and with out anyone watching the fort, or emails. He is still a good man in my books.
|Why not just make your own harness, then? You could go to the U Pull It, buy a couple of harnesses from newer cars, use the wire and fuseboxes and relays and waterproof connectors from them. Probably cost you $20. And it would be state of the art, fuses available at any Kwik Shop. Get some of that bendy tubing with the slit down the middle, too. Very little cost, your buddy is gonna wire it up, Bob's yer uncle!|
|Marcello, you are fortunate to have a buddy with experience in automotive wiring. Even with no experience my installation was a pleasant job, but did have it's moments. Rick is correct in that a harness with the terminations already made does make a big difference and has value. Cutting wire and making terminations was a big part of the job. I purchased extra terminals from British Wiring to match the several multi plug terminals on my car and they were excellent to work with. |
As far as same wire, Advance wire is totally different being one guage heavier and a totally different insulation , similar to aircraft spec.
Here is a website you may find interesting;
Good luck with your project,
|Sorry, cut and paste web address never seems to work for me. |
and continue from there.
I am thrifty but not that thrifty. I want a painless kit not a painful kit.
|OK, buddy. Just suggestions.|
What in particular has made you decide to rewire your car?
If you go to different colors of wire, save a diagram for future owners.
You just reminded me how much I hate my stock wiring harness on my 73.
What a piece of work that harness is! There are miles of unfused wire coming from the battery through the car before it gets to the little fuse box in the engine bay. What were they thinking!?
Also...full headlight current runs through the cheap plastic toggle switch on the dash...No relay!! Again, what were they thinking? A while ago my stock headlight switch melted and I had to fix that..
I'm not ready to replace the whole harness yet. I'm counting on the main power (battery) kill switch I have mounted in the drivers foot well area to save me if I ever smell some burning wires. I always hit the kill switch whenever I park the car.
Gotta love that Lucas wiring.
Good luck Marcello. Let us know how it comes out
|HP Henry Patterson|
|Marcello- 0ne thing about Dan's kit. The wire size is a big upgrade from the spegetti in our original harnesses. Big improvement.|
Henry has answered your question you asked me.....lol
Thanks Henry I will let all know how it goes. I will keep the dia. for future owners (I will do my best to keep the colours the same original)
As mentioned above any "new" harness is a upgrade from the original. Not only Dan's. I do not think it is hurting the car if you replace it with something better and modern that makes it live longer. I know you "orig parts" guys are rolling your eyes , but I like to drive my car.
I have been driving my "original" tr6 for 5 years now (since purchase and restore) with narry a problem. The wiring harness is 100% OE (except for OD wiring) but did a very thorough cleaning and check of every circuit as I was doing the body off restoration. Have only had one problem and that was the 4 way flasher switch preventing my turns from working....a few flicks of the switch and contacts clean again:).
Do not have a problem with upgrades.....as long as they are kinda invisible ( ie. pertronix ignition, hardened valve seats, "wrapped" new wiring harnesses that look OE).
Rick makes a good point. besides the melted headlight switch mine has been trouble free as well.
Some basic improvements could be made to the original harness such as converting the headlight wiring to relay activated...still using the original toggle switch to activate the low current side of the relay.
I've been thinking about adding some large fuses to the main wiring right at the battery. Based on the large guage main wiring (large brown wires) at the battery some 30 amp fuses would protect all of the unfused wiring pretty well.
That's if I get around to it. I may just wait til something goes wrong. I still have my fire extingusher handy.
|HP Henry Patterson|
I understand, wow I feel guilty now if I go non OE harness. Please understand as it stands right now this will not be the only thing on my 73 TR that isn't OE. The PO changed a few things before my purchase so not much here to preserve. I wouldn't go this route if it was a 100% OE car. C'mon support me on this!!??
In my opinion.. Unless you're going to show your car at a concourse level there's nothing wrong with going non OE. And as Rick suggests much of it can be hidden. The point being made is that we have done well with the OE wiring harness. If you have the time and patience to do it right then by all means do it. I'm just rationalizing that my OE harness will do fine for now. That just means I don't have to do any work or spend any money on that for time being.
Even if you want to preserve the OE look you could hide the new fuse block up under the passenger side dash area. Assuming the kits give you that kind of flexibility.
|HP Henry Patterson|
You got my support. read... "wrapped" new wiring harnesses that look OE).
Do a nice job of wrapping the wiring bundle and it will look OE.
Yup Do it!
On my way ....
Stay tuned for pics, tips and flips....
For some reason, I haven't gotten any e-mails from you.
There are significant differences between the kits we sell and those from Ron Francis, Painless, Hot rod wires, etc.
1) Our wires are color coded to match Lucas colors.
2) We use 7 relays - none of the others use more than two, most use only one. Save your switches!
3) Our kits are designed for British cars, and our instructions are written with british cars in mind, including a schematic diagram for each particular model. Actually, we supply three copies - one to wire by, one for checking your wiring, and one for permanent reference).
4) We supply all the bullet/sleeve connectors needed to interface with British electrial components. We include $25 - $30 worth of bullet/sleeves with each kit, depending on model.
5) We know British cars, and tech support is just an e-mail or a phone call away. When you call me (I'm the tech support guy - my son builds the kits), You get someone who knows your car and can walk you through any problems you may be having. Try getting tech help on a British car from any of the others!
Thanks for your interest.
|"converting the headlight wiring to relay activated...still using the original toggle switch to activate the low current side of the relay."|
Our kits include two headlight relays - one for the hi beams and one for the low beams, acuated by the original switches. We also sell a separate relay kit for headlights.
Good thing you come and visit this BBS once in a while.
Marcello, Dan has some good points especially #4.
1: Has ANY of the other suppliers of wiring kits come close to what Dan has done to help us keep out LBCs on the road??
2: Has ANY of the other suppliers been on this BBS and helped out with our unique problems??
3: Do any of the other suppliers know our LBC like Dan does??
I thinik it is also a case of...."support our suppliers".
|Not only that, his son is flying to P.R. to help a guy finish wiring his 6. Now that is customer service. What are the chances I can get dan to fly to Seattle to tape mine up????|
I thought that you had yours all installed and finished!! I've been anticipating using your experience (along with Dan's counsel) to wire mine when I get to that point:)
|Marcello, Any progress? What harness have you chosen? Are there any pics, tips and flips...?|
Just retired her for the summer and rolled her in to the garage 2 days ago and started the fall/winter project.
My apologies for not going your route (I only wish we chatted sooner) I do not know why my messages and emails didn't reach you. Bad news is I already purchased another brand and they won't take it back. I will move forward anyway and take your advice and buy additional relay's.
Dash was removed Saturday. Look for updates and images soon.
What kit did you buy? Non-stock aftermarket or stock replacement? One of the problems with the other non-stock aftermarket kits is that they are intended for street rods and the instructions are not very good for a Triumph. If you need help with converting the instructions to your TR, let me know and I will help.
I went with the "Hot Rod Wires"
So far so good. Going to add extra relays, and run my grounds direct from battery and close to it. So if there are problems i do not need to go on a scavenger hunt.
This thread was discussed between 21/08/2006 and 04/11/2006
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